Flying Scotsman

The full line up of surviving LNER Pacifics plus Tornado, of course.

And - incredibly, wonderfully - a P2 as well...

 

Quite possibly!!!

 

You are quite right.

 

The livery makes perfect sense to me, majority of coach rakes on mainline are BR liveried, so unless your going to go to spend a long time, alot of cash and jump a few hundred hurdles to put a gresley teak rake on the mainline then its the better solution, after all the majority of its time will be spent on the mainline.

 

Quite a remarkable thought really, isn't it? Who could have imagined all those years ago we'd not only have the complete line up of LNER's finest pacifics (i.e. A1, A2, A3 & A4) but also a P2 as a bonus.

Some might question the P2's presence if such a gathering is eventually arranged, though few could argue that, despite their flaws, back then they we're ranked as one of the LNER's top express engines.

Certainly I'd like to think with a perfected P2, it would be more then worthy to join the line up.

 

Now if only we could have an original GNR A1 pacific named "Great Northern" for good measure...

 

Or Green Arrow working...

 

Nooooo! Can we please not mention Great Northern!? Theres a a whole other thread for that!

 

..............but not the livery, thank God!!!

 

Im sure it would look lovely in BR lined Blue! Hat, Run, Take, Cover and For. Rearange and put it in a sentance Im already there!

 

Actually Martin, it was 98772 - and I have a shot of it coming through Leamington with the numberplate fitted

 

Well, [flame proof overall on] as they are (sensibly) building an inauthentic P2, how can it possibly have an inauthentic livery?


[later] or, as someone pointed out below, how can it have an authentic livery either. Clearly all true enthusiasts must band together to prevent the build team from putting any top coat on at all so the loco remains in gray primer...

 

That would be what I call the 'Tornado Theory' if its a new build, how can any livery it carries be unauthentic? Anyone for a P2 in BR lined Green or 45551 in BR Maroon?!

 

Actually I would argue that one the other way round - how can any livery it carries, other than that of its current or previous owner(s), be authentic? The only authentic livery that Tornado has carried so far is grey with "www.a1steam.com" on the tender.

 

I understand why the NRM have decided to go for BR dark green livery. I don't like it, but I'd much rather see her running like that than static in the museum in any other livery. I'm slightly surprised by some of the people I'm agreeing with and disagreeing with on this, but that's OK. It helps to make the point that "enthusiasts" are not a single homogeneous group with a single set of beliefs and preferences. I also understand the pleas for an end to this sub-topic within this thread. However, on this occasion, I want to have my say...

FS has been apple green 4472 for almost all of my lifetime. My first encounters with her were on the TV in 1968 (the film of the non-stop run to Edinburgh) and in the Rev. Awdry's Railway Series books. My best friend at primary school had a Tri-ang Hornby model of her (I had 34051 Winston Churchill, repainted by my Dad as 21C142 Dorchester!). I first saw her in the metal at Paignton (cold in the shed, IIRC) in the early 1970s. All were as 4472 in apple green. I associate BR liveries with the decline and fall of steam on the mainline - filthy locos clanking and leaking, and wheezing their way to the scrapyards. Pre-BR liveries represent, for me, the astonishing resurrection of the survivors, thanks to the skill, generosity, vision, determination and perhaps obsession of the preservation pioneers.

The NRM likes to use its exhibits to tell the stories of railway history. The history of steam railway locos didn't stop in 1968 (or earlier). It entered a new phase, that of "preservation". They stopped being the prime motive power for the national railway network and became a leisure activity for thousands of volunteers and millions of visitors. The one exhibit in the NRM collection that can really tell that story is Flying Scotsman. Alan Pegler's initial purchase and decision to re-build with a single chimney, Mr McAlpine's rescue from the States, Dr Marchington's decision to mix a double chimney, smoke deflectors and LNER livery (along with all the other modifications), the public appeals that helped the NRM buy her, are part of Scotsman's story, and representative of the "movement" as a whole. So too are the decisions that the NRM make about her now. I think the best way to tell that story is with Flying Scotsman in apple green numbered 4472.

Besides, bright LNER green shows up in in a dull January landscape much better than the BR camouflage shade! ;-)

 

I wouldn't have objected to apple green with the website address on the tender, rather than British Railways.

 

I think give the extensive rebuild of this locomotive it's fair to say it will be around for a good few years yet. During which time i'm sure there will be plenty of opportunities to see it in whatever livery, chimney arrangement, smoke deflector style you desire. Anthony Coulls has stated many times on this forum that the NRM is open to suggestions, especially if you have a way of raising the finance required. So if you don't like it, raise the money for it's next repaint and then you can have a say.

Personally i think it's worst years of it's history were probably spent in apple green with smoke deflectors. So i think it is a good idea for the engine to have a new livery for it's new lease of life, and distance it from those dark days under Dr Marchington.

Anyway steam locos were traditionally painted in whatever livery their owners wanted. So as long as the NRM chooses the livery it will always be accurate

Tim

 

That could have been made to look good, I think. It's not the colour that matters - any organisation can use any colour - it's carrying the name of an organisation who never owned the loco. Varieties of the A1 Steam logos could have been made to work with Apple Green, BR Green and BR Blue (although they would have needed to redesign their website every time they repainted the loco).