9642 0-6-0PT

Hello,
I am sure that the said owner of the stock mentioned has a sense of humour!
All written with a big silly smile!


Nick

 

I think you may be right this time but there were letters in the Railway press along these lines when the Welshpool &Llanfair project got under way

 

It took the devil of a long time for the W&LLR to become established. Eventually the freehold (including the rail) was bought for the vast sum of £8,000 (raised with some difficulty). As the poem puts it "Those days are gone away"

PH

 

Does that affect the future of 44027 as well if its in Mr Gs custody?

 

That's already gone to sharpness...

 

Thanks, wasn't aware. Thought GWR were part of the deal with NRM as well.

 

I remember 9642

Yep. http://valeofberkeleyrailway.co.uk/?q=node/50 Although I read elsewhere that only the boiler had arrived and frames etc were coming later.

 

I seem to recall an interview in a certain railway magazine with the then Boss of the Severn Valley Railway, Mr Michael Draper, I believe, in the early 1980s, saying that the Gloucestershire Warwickshire Railway would never achieve anything as there were already plenty of heritage railways and that it could not survive. Funny old world isn't it?!

As a postscript, I stood on the partially completed platform 1 at Toddington in 1981 and mentally agreed with him, against my heart's wishes. How sweet it is that the heart won! That said, the Cotswolds is a tourist magnet, whereas Sharpness may be less so. This does not mean that the scheme will fail - it just has to be "sold" correctly.

 

There is a very nice castle/stately home near me called Belvoir Castle. Some wag informed me that he knew the founding family to be the famous cyder-belvoirs, the 1st duke being Justin. (I'm here all week.)

 

Ah yes, I knew someone would mention Draper! I think he got it a bit wrong though. He based his thoughts on the theory that the country could only sustain a certain number of heritage railways. I disagree, I think there was an era where establishing a heritage railway was possible, and as time.went by it got more difficult with less stuff available and now with prices increasing it has made it virtually impossible to start anew IMHO. However I shall keep an eye on this because, as it said in the latest steam beano I think, they're unusual in having some stock already lined up. It's hardly everything, but it is a start.

 

I think Drapers view was that the limiting factor would be finance and availability of rolling stock, it now seems that available volunteer labour may kill off some of the new schemes or at least delay their implementation. The fear is it will also impact on established railways.

 

Draper liked making provocative statements, and Steam Railway liked publishing them - it sold magazines. He opined that the pool of visitors and money was finite, and new railways would just take business away from more established lines. He seemed not to realise that competition comes from other attractions, not just other railways - and I think (from memory) his comments may have pre-dated Sunday shopping, which has had a huge impact on visitor attractions.

 

I think Micheal Draper was spot on to be honest. There is a finite amount of labour, finance and suitable stock avaialble. There is also a proliferation of schemes that are quite frankly ludicrous and can only dilute what there is up and running. I think his prophecy of a contraction in schemes will occur. The only thing he didn't get right was the timeframe. Volunteers are getting older, retirement age is increasing, rolling stock and infrastructure are requiring ever more expensive repair solutions. Look at the number of bridge renewals on preserved railways that are costing big bucks. look at the number of cylinder blocks, boilers and frames of locos that require replacement. The expertise is there to do it however the finance and volunteer manpower to drastically rebuild all the locos, rolling stock and infrastructure certainly isn't. The SVR just survived the great flooding of a decade ago. What will happen when Victoria Bridge is finally life-expired??

 

If I put my PaulHitchian gloomy hat on, I think availability of rolling stock may come to be a defining issue for the movement. Even Mark 1s are now between 50 and 65 years old; there are no more coming from the mainline, so the stock is finite, and they are known to be prone to significant bodyside corrosion that, if left untreated, ultimately requires an expensive overhaul. Added to which, each train you run only requires one locomotive, but typically between three and eight carriages. I wonder how many railways have the long-term capacity to manage that situation? Obviously there are private contractors who can do the job, so you can trade availability of in-house skills for money - if you have the money.

Probably best discussed in the "expansion" thread though to avoid taking this one too far off topic.

Tom

 

I think the established railways have one last bubble left in them - bequests - and it is to be very much hoped that they don't waste them! It's the best chance they have of building some significant cash reserves against future rainy days. The problem is that so many lines are in urgent need of sheds, track replacement, bridge replacement and the like that the money will go on these.

I'm more sanguine about carriages because I see more and more pre-BR stock gradually being restored, to the point where some railways could start to ask the question of whether they could let Mk1s go in favour of earlier vehicles. The answer is probably no at this time but that may change in future.

In a way I agreed with Michael Draper, although more on the steam loco side - every new line that opens and aspires to run ex-BR locos results in a dilution of what is on the established railways - look at what the Vale of Berkeley is doing to the GWSR as an example of that. Now, the GWSR has more engines available than it currently needs, but even the ones out of use are a potential museum attraction whilst they await overhaul, and they can be turned to advantage in attractions like the Engine House. I think most of us would find the SVR, NYMR or Bluebell rather duller if they had just the number of engines to cover the service and overhauls.

 

To be fair to Michael Draper, David Shepherd was saying similar things at around the same time. Indeed, he predicted that at least one major line would close before the end of the 80s and a couple did come fairly close, albeit slightly later.

 

I note that the intention for the Vale of Berkeley Railway is only to "run heritage tourist trains from Sharpness to Berkeley". That will be an very short ride, though I suppose comparable to some other short lines that are more in the nature of museums with a bit of track that railways going anywhere.

 

And of course Berkeley is famous for its hunt...

 

Deleted due to possible banning!

 

That's cheating, you didn't even post then edit, so I can't even check email alerts!