Flying Scotsman

What do you mean by a bag of bits And what problem?

 

From Southern Locomotives website:

British Railways Green
What colour was British Railways Green? It's a question that is often asked, and who better to respond than Richard Green, whose Locos-in-Profile fine art prints have featured Bulleid Pacifics in several liveries:

When the Big Four were nationalised to form British Railways, one early task was to choose new liveries for the locomotive fleet. Several different experimental liveries were tried, generally based on those used by the old railway companies, and the decision was made to have four variations. Class 8 passenger locomotives were to be blue with white & black lining with other passenger locomotives in green with orange & black lining. Mixed traffic locomotives were to be black with LNWR lining and freight locomotives just plain black. The blue livery was soon dropped due to it not being hard wearing enough.

The green livery chosen for passenger locomotives was in fact the same as that used by the Great Western Railway, with minor variations to the lining. The green colour used by the Great Western was middle chrome green and this is the colour specified by the Railway Executive with samples sent to the various paint shops. The chrome orange lining used sits very harmoniously on middle chrome green owing to their common origins. However after research into longer lasting finishes the formulation of the green was altered in 1956; this used Monastral blue and a new yellow pigment marketed by ICI and gave a slightly darker shade - nearer deep bronze green. Whether Swindon changed to this new formulation it would be interesting to know! I believe that Deep Bronze Green, produced by Willamsons of Ripon, is now used by preservationist as the best match available.

Brunswick green is often used when describing Great Western and British Railways green, but is completely erroneous and it seems to have been started by the model railway fraternity in the early 1950s. Recently there have been some preserved GWR tanks running around in colours that look suspiciously like proper Brunswick green, so maybe they got what they asked for! Brunswick green can be seen today on preserved SECR locomotives and is sometimes referred to as 'Chatham' green, it also seems to have been the green used by the Great Central Railway.


1. Deep Bronze, as used by BR from 1956 2. Middle Brunswick 3. Middle Chrome, as used by GWR and originally specified by BR 4. Middle Bronze 5. Olive 6. Deep Brunswick.


So, how to describe the green used by British Railways in any period? Maybe the best option is to just call it BR green!

Some of the above information has been taken from LMS Locomotive Profiles No. 11 : The 'Coronation' Class Pacifics by David Hunt, John Jennison, Bob Meanley, Fred James & Bob Essary. This book gives a complete account of the liveries carried by the Princess Coronations and can be highly recommended to anyone wanting detailed information on the class.

Richard Green (January 2014)

 

Check out the pictures of Duchess of Sutherland in BR green a year or so ago. The same as flying Scotsman is now. as to Crewe and Doncaster using different colours - almost certainly - and I bet Eastleigh, Swindon and Darlington had their own preferences too.

edit - hmm, Mr Coulls has produced a good colour chart, perhaps he could confirm or deny whether the various works indulged in their own variations.

 

You could argue that my memories of BR green are not sullied with images of miserable dirty engines right at the end which is also not a fair representative of the colour.
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This is the the giveaway that you don't remember BR steam, Kings Cross Pacifics were normally well turned out right up to the end, look at some of the pictures from that era. New England and Gateshead were generally the opposite.

 

The giveaway that I don't remember BR steam is that I'm only 17! I know that some locos were cared for right to the end but equally, as you yourself said, many were not, and my obscure, probably irrelevant and convoluted point still stands!

 

I thought it might be but then why does it make so many stops en route and where are the main train timings?

 

It'll make an interesting comparison with the NRMs recently repainted 34051 bearing a livery of the same era.

 

Why am I one of the few who love this lighter shade of green? The darker greens are out there on other locomotives and this offers a nice contrast if not prototypical.

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As I recall that was slightly darker - I think Ollie said it was the deep bronze green by Williams. Still, I don't recall seeing 34051 in sunlight, so that might change how it looks.

edit - FS was painted at York, so maybe Mr Coulls knows what was written on the tins of paint used?

 

Anthony,
When I researched NER 'Saxony Green' I managed to get hold of a colour & lining template from Darlington Works, courtesy of the Ken Hoole Trust. This was normally kept in darkness to conserve the true colour. I got Williamsons to match this. Did the various works have colour/lining templates for 'BR green' and does the NRM have any? If they do, has this been used for a match? If it has then we have something objective, rather than subjective.

 

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U59844/2016/02/25/advanced

Here!

James

 

I was just comparing the pics of 60103 to that I took of Britannia in the summer - almost identical

 

You do realise that photo was taken in Full Devon Sunlight. Less air pollution to affect the colour contrasts and filters of your camera in this part of the country.

 

None of the photographs I have seen of 60103 today have shown the same shade of green. I will make my own mind up on Thursday when I see it in the flesh!

Regardless, she looks amazing, sounded wonderful in the video posted earlier. What an incredible job all round.

 

I just watched a couple 46233 vids from 2012 fresh out of overhaul and she does look darker.


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D...d...Devon?!? Is that where they do cream teas the wrong way round?! In Cornwall however..

Hehehehe

 

There's sound logic in doing it the Devon way. On the basis of stability, the components need to get smaller as they go higher. Cornish ones have a dollop of jam on the scone followed by a smaller dollop of cream on top. Devon ones have an mouth watering amount of cream followed by an artistically pleasant spoonful of jam on top to contrast with the cream, both in colour and texture. A delight to the eye. And to eat.
It also frequently rains in Cornwall so you can't sit out in the garden to enjoy your cream tea. It rarely rains in Devon because it's protected from this by Cornwall.

 

Did anyone actually get any footage of yesterdays test run rather than worrying about the livery, again!