Banking engines

What are the rules regarding banking engines on preserved lines? Can they still be uncoupled during banking & drop off at the top?

 

Certainly not in KESR rules. I believe not permitted anywhere for trains conveying passengers.

Edit: except of course for assisting departing trains as far as the starting signal eg trains leaving Victoria.

 

That will depend on the individual railway's rulebook. It needs a safe system of work, which shouldn't be an impossible task. On the NYMR we can and do give trains a helping hand leaving Grosmont only as far as the next signal if uncoupled.

 

It certainly was allowed even on the national network not all that long ago: On 11-12-1999 a railtour (which I was on) was banked up the Lickey and the banking engine just dropped away at the top.

 

There is a sign at Warminster instructing assisted trains to stop & uncouple the banker.

 

Believe it's still permitted as such on the Lickey, but obviously isn't used for anything other than freight these days.

The last couple of banked steam tours have seen the loco coupled, but that's more to do with it hitching a free lift back to Tyseley after Blackwell.

 

I've now remembered a comment on here by someone pointing out that, on the climb from Exeter St Davids to Central, the banking loco does have to be coupled on, because of the curvature. So I think the general answer is that coupling is required in some circumstances but not all.

 

Banking engines must be coupled if running in a single line block section. In BR days the only exceptions where when there was a separate banking token, such as once existed on the climb out of Fishguard. This allowed the banking engine to drop off mid section and return to Fishguard and Goodwick station. There was a similar arrangement on the climb out of Bath on the S & D.

 

I'm not sure that there was always a banking token. There certainly was on the S&D because that was single line and the loco returned from Coombe Down to Bath. Where there was double track and the loco could return on the correct road was there always a banking staff or token?

There isn't a particular issue with banking within station limits, but for most heritage railways the lack of a banking staff would preclude any uncoupled operation in section. Banking on the MHR is pretty commonplace (coupled) and seen at most galas at some point or other.

 

Banking tokens were only used on single lines, and were quite rare ! If there was no banking token provided, the banker had to be coupled.

 

Although not directly linked, I saw a pic of 1501 and (I think) Taw Valley being split in section to cross the Victoria Bridge on the SVR separately. A comment was made that there is a special bell code.

This is the only time I have heard of a locos uncoupling in section under 'normal' operation.

 

I dont have the full signalling instructions, I am only a guard, so cant comment on bell codes.

I can however confirm that special local instructions for Victoria Bridge are in the general appendix which I do have. The manouvers may only be made in clear weather

 

The banker certainly didn't have to be coupled Upwey Bank out of Weymouth, those of us around at the time will remember Sir Nigel's finest No 4498 romping away up the bank with the banker, an Ivatt Micky Mouse Tank unable to keep up

 

The OP asked about preserved lines. Can we have more replies on the original question please?

 

And ruin the best traditions of every forum, everywhere....?

 

Bincombe bank

 

On a single line it would be possible to do with staff & ticket working as the train engine would have a ticket and the banker the staff. Having the staff would preclude another train being sent into section until the banker + staff returns to the box in rear. With key token or tablet working it couldn't work, hence the need for a banking key arrangement. the NYMR still uses staff & ticket (just) between Levisham & Pickering but there is no need for banking on what is a relatively level stretch of line. I m not aware of any other line that uses staff & ticket working these days, other than the TR between Abergynolwyn & Nant Gwernol but, again, there is no need for a banker. Banking of the first train of the day on the TR was quite common in the 1960's and uncoupled banking was performed on occasions when the whole line east of Pendre was staff & ticket.

 

We have both coupled and uncoupled banking at Foxfield. On passenger workings we have a banking staff and the train comes to a stand for the banking loco to detach and return LE with the staff. On Foxfield Bank we can operate either coupled bankers through to the summit or uncoupled banking only part way staying within station limits.

 

first time I've ever seen it referred to as Bincombe Bank.

 

My recollection of banking on the Talyllyn in the 1960's is that the loco of the previous down arrival would remain on the back and bank the next up train out of Wharf station. This would be done with the banker uncoupled (and the tail lamp on the last vehicle - always a brake van) and it would only bank as far as the Wharf "calling on" signal i.e. station limits. It would then reverse to Wharf for coal and water to take out the next up train.
This was a regular feature during the busy peak season, but when the gradients between Wharf and Pendre were eased it was no longer necessary.
Attached is a shot that I took of the newly rebuilt No 2 performing the honours in 1963.

Usually, any assistance required beyond the Wharf limit was provided by double heading - to Brynglas or all the way to Abergynolwyn, depending on the load, rail conditions and timetable. This was in the days of two-train working (passing at Brynglas only) and trains tended to be longer and heavier than today.



.