Cumbrian Coast Express 9/4/16

In SLOA days there was some problem with standing passengers . When I booked, and was told sorry full up ,I sometimes said I would 'nt mind standing only to be told , Sorry can't be done,. But with compartment /corridor stock a lot of passengers stood up all day by the window in any case.

 

Well said, I couldn't have put it better myself.

 

Another own goal from WRC/RTC. I wonder how you're covered if you bought by credit card?

 

I should think they are absolutely bang to rights if you bought on a credit card - total failure to deliver and eligible for a Consumer Credit Act refund.

I can understand WCRC having focussed on safety management but having a spare carriage available at Southall and Carnforth is probably a sensible minimum. I'm surprising they couldn't shunt one out in 5 hours at Carnforth - maybe they need to clear some of the clutter in the yard! Its also not like they've been in heavy use in recent weeks so any backlog of maintenance should be completed.

 

I wonder if some of the spare stock is in use for the Grand National. I haven't checked but I wonder if there any specials to Liverpool today from various locations.

 

I was one of those unlucky ones at Preston along with twenty or thirty others I should think. The information at the station was pretty abysmal, screen went from 15 late to cancelled, how can that be? I rang RTC and the lass rang me back, explained the situation clearly just as Les Ross trundled through. She said WCR had told them it would take a couple of hours at Carnforth to move a coach into place and on that basis they had decided they couldn't afford that sort of delay.

I was pretty gutted at the time, my Mrs would have been incandescent if she'd been there, but did I fancy standing for seven hours regardless of legality? Probably not.

Will try and blag a Waverley ticket next week in exchange. Not holding breath however!

I met a nice photographer at Preston who told me two rumours, (a) test run for Leander next Thursday, (b) single line running at Eden Brows on the S and C in a couple of months time. Don't shoot the messenger but I thought I'd pass that on.

 

Surely the answer to this is cost, pure and simple. A standby coach will need to be paid for, in full fitness-to-run status. If the set was last used a week ago that is a whole week for those vehicles earning nothing. Add a standby, and that is a coach which may well earn nothing from one week to the next. So this will mean another increase in the ticket price , borne by the 10 coaches' worth of fare-paying passengers. How much are people prepared to pay for there to be a standby available? Is one standby enough- should there be another at Carnforth ready to go? A diesel driver at Carnforth on weekend overtime ready to shunt if required?

This is not meant to be a defence of WCR, and is of course no consolation to those who have had their not already-inexpensive day out ruined (resulting in reputational damage and loss of future bookings), but simply to highlight again the challenges faced by the main line steam railtour business .

Jon

 

Thanks for the update. If the coach was already coupled behind the support coach before the loco backed on how would this take another two hours? The coach might be on the "wrong side" of the diners but so what, any port in a storm! Sounds a bit Jim Royle to me, "can't be ars*d!"

 

Could be. But there were at least three trains out today-- the Skegness one, the Newport one and the CCE. I don't know the rules but what if there simply weren't any coaches left up at Carnforth which had been used at all recently? Would it need a test? Brakes dragging at Oxenholme would not be good news. My wife has just said--why didn't they just add a caboose?

Peter

 

Not sure about the Grand National but Radio 5 Live had an interesting commentary earlier...

"So a warm welcome to all who've tuned in for the 5.25 West Coast Handicap here at Southall where the going is soft to decidedly muddy. It's a brisk morning & we already have one non-runner to announce. Tourist Open (64/1) has unfortunately been declared unfit by the vet and Shunters Nightmare (9/5) which should have been a last-minute substitute was found wanting & had to be pulled up short.

And they're off (or will be in five hours from now). Here they come round the Euston bend and everyone is settling in for this 600 mile chase. Because of the number of riders and shortage of runners there seems to be some bunching at the front but so far there have been no fallers and they're all over the first, in fact they're all over the standard and buffet as well.

Just past the half way mark & it's very close race. In the lead is Inside Knowledge, second is Public Relations & coming up on the outside is Preston Boarder. It's still Inside knowledge well ahead of Public Relations with Common Sense trailing as a distant third. Preston Boarder is making a strong challenge now but is easily outflanked by the first two and left standing by the rest of the field.

As they turn into the final straight Inside Knowledge is now jockeying for position with Self Interest and the rest are absolutely nowhere. And at the line the final result is Self Interest by a brass neck from Inside Knowledge & the remainder failed to finish. A real coup for the owners but sadly another bad day for the punters."

 

Good to see the paying customer comes first. Appalling that with all the technology around WCRC or RTC couldn't find a away to get the situation explained to waiting passengers at Preston.

 

Passing through Ravenglass.

 

I was driving up the M6 to Docker for a snap and near Garstang when Les Ross and its nine coaches came rolling past doing about 90mph and looking very nice too. Thought the train looked fairly short - I now know why !

 

Not to have stopped is shocking enough. But with modern day communications, are you telling me that nobody called have called Preston station and requested that someone could convey a message to waiting passengers that the train was full and would not stop. Disgraceful especially as in this case, Mr and Mrs W had a reservation in a part of the train that was not affected.

 

You may be right with the number of trains running, but with that number running surely if a problem was found on say Thursday (that meant removal from the rake) a spare coach would be surely be available. The WCRC line was that it would take two hours; not that there were no spare coaches available.

With the train this full what would happen if a coach became defective in a) Carnforth loop or b) at Carlisle? Answers please to WCRC. How would you deal with the effect on passengers? Answers please to RTC.

 

As far as I am aware. as has been stated, standing in a passenger train in the UK in not against rules and regulations. Commuting as I do from London, that is clear for all to see. The train should have stopped at Preston, passenger made aware of the situation and told that they could not offer a seat but passengers could stand. I bet you all the money you have, that most passengers would have been happy to stand! The whole thing stinks and it is a sure fire way of losing customers.

 

Came past Carnforth earlier and must admit it did look very sparse compared to usual in terms of rolling stock, Leander was visible although couldn't tell if she was in steam.

It must have been gutting at Preston, however unless RYTC had someone there not sure how the problem could have been easily rectified - although I admit there seems to have been little effort either way. Even if you get the message through that customers have to get to Carnforth on service train you have to make sure they all get through to Carnforth for a certain time (trying to heard those away from the Pendolino that doesnt stop at Lancaster) - which has to be articulated to all passengers, then you have to shunt a replacement carriage from the maze at Carnforth and attach to the POB - not sure how early RS left Steamtown but from experience they tend to spend a long time at in the loops waiting?

Then you have the issue of getting passengers into said coach, either in ST or Carnforth station, but do locomotives passing from ST to the loop actually pass the platforms and if not do WCRC have the ability and more importantly paperwork in place to move passengers from ST onto the mainline (I am mindful of the minefield VT seem to have to negotiate to allow passengers to board on site at Tyseley), in both cases they would be in a leading vehicle for part of the journey - is that allowed even on a very short shunting move - possibly involving short term access to the WCML?

There are so many options that could be considered, but equally so many hoops to pass through, it appears to have been a mess, but its also important to remember that on the modern railway this isn't like introducing a coach onto a set on a train set, but instead on the modern railway with ORR watching like hawks - I fear doing things by the book presently outbids doing things to help passengers in WCRC's mind - sadly.

Some positives - I wonder whether this is why there was no tail gunner in sight when she came through Cark earlier and it does give the normal WCRC bashers something to get their teeth into so coon after the return so many winners despite the poor buggers at Preston. I feel your pain and hope that you get suitably compensated for a buggered up day!

Finally I note the normal unsavory bashing of @RalphW has returned, who I suspect is somewhat better informed than the armchair warriors on here and passes on what he has been told on the train..... you may have your own opinions of what he is saying but is the tone taken really necessary?

Anyway the only opinions that really matter are those who missed out - I hope it gets sorted to your satisfaction

 

Sadly not convinced that standing affects loadings, had my first experience of the new Northern franchise today, the 1520 Lancaster to Barrow was a single carriage unit, leading to much standing and cramming in (including my and many other 3 year old's having to stand in the aisle).....

Note the branding has all been removed, assume the new branding will be attached shortly, can I suggest - Northern - Bringing Third World conditions to Britain's Railways!

 

46100 from high above Salterwath , St Bees and Dalton Bank .