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VT Christmas Lyndum Fayre 3/12/2016

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by 85Merlin, Nov 29, 2016.

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  1. 85Merlin

    85Merlin New Member

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    E - mail from VT this morning. Train cancelled. Engine declared out of gauge.

    ian
     
    85Merlin, Nov 29, 2016
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  2. 85Merlin

    85Merlin New Member

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    Apologies for title. Predictive text again!
     
    85Merlin, Nov 29, 2016
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  3. Ben Vintage-Trains

    Ben Vintage-Trains Member

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    Ian, you beat me to it!

    We were surprised to find that 5043 is now prohibited from multiple platforms in Nottingham. Last year we passed through Nottingham with 5043 and had no hint of a restriction, so this is all incredibly frustrating.

    We were offered the option of taking 47773 instead, but decided that as the majority of passengers had paid to ride behind steam, it was not a viable option. I have to say that NetRail train planning tried to be as accommodating as possible and did offer us an alternative plan, but it was nothing we considered workable given the offering sold to the passengers.

    We do have space in Standard and Club classes next week to York and we hope to accommodate as many passengers as possible. All passengers have the option of transferring to another tour, a credit note or a full refund.

    To say we are disappointed and frustrated is an understatement.
     
    Ben Vintage-Trains, Nov 29, 2016
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  4. Harry Stanger

    Harry Stanger New Member

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    You couldn't make this up. NR are not fit for their purpose of maintaining the National Network. I truly feel for Vintage Trains and their passengers.
     
    Harry Stanger, Nov 29, 2016
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  5. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    Don't worry, sorted..:)
     
    RalphW, Nov 29, 2016
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  6. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    So, Vintage Trains gets brownie points from Network Rail for their handling of the Pannier trip and in the next breath have all their careful plans ruined because, apparently, Network Rail's track is not where it was a year ago. You do wonder how our national rail network provider can get away with this stuff.
     
    Big Al, Nov 29, 2016
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  7. LMarsh1987

    LMarsh1987 Part of the furniture Friend

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    If this was a Scotsman trip there would be uproar !
     
    LMarsh1987, Nov 29, 2016
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  8. John Stewart

    John Stewart Part of the furniture

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    But it hasn't been moved in that time at Nottingham. It seems a case of NR not checking if it's been creeping in the night when no-one was looking.:(
     
    John Stewart, Nov 29, 2016
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  9. 85Merlin

    85Merlin New Member

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    Didn't intend to steal your thunder, Ben! I suspect you had other things on your mind this morning. Once again, full marks to VT for their honest and straightforward response to an unpredictable situation.
    Ian
     
    85Merlin, Nov 29, 2016
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  10. huochemi

    huochemi Part of the furniture

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    And they want to overhaul another gauge-unfriendly loco. Curiouser and curiouser. They may want to consider making an offer to the 73156 shareholders if they want to develop the steam business.
     
    huochemi, Nov 30, 2016
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  11. david1984

    david1984 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Castles aint that bad compared to some other GWR types, I do wonder if it's physically out of gauge or another case of lapsed paperwork where no one has been to check for a while ?.
     
    david1984, Nov 30, 2016
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  12. GWR4707

    GWR4707 Nat Pres stalwart

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    I suspect that 5043 has been on the bacon sandwiches again!

    Seriously though it adds further credence to the RERPS aspirations to get the Train from Spain running ASAP, the way its going in about 10 years only locomotives on the 15" gauge will actually fit on NR?

    Question if 5043 and say a Class 158 fitted 12 months ago, does the 158 actually fit now, I know NR gauge every steam tour, do they do the same regularly with modern stock which is built to the same loading gauge?
     
    GWR4707, Nov 30, 2016
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  13. 5944

    5944 Resident of Nat Pres

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    According to a post on WNXX, 5043 is only gauged for a few platforms at Nottingham, and the station is very busy that day due to all the extra Lincoln specials running.
     
    5944, Nov 30, 2016
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  14. Harry Stanger

    Harry Stanger New Member

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    And NR didn't know that when they accepted the tour.....makes their competence even more questionable
     
    Harry Stanger, Nov 30, 2016
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  15. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    Quote from wnxx.

    "Only certain platforms at Nottingham are gauged for the Hall or the Castle to pass through, but unfortunately these platforms aren't available at the required times thanks to the half hourly service between Nottingham and Newark Castle. Add all the extra Nottingham-Lincolns that are booked either Meridians or HSTs and this compounds the problem...
    They could of routed it via the centre roads.... oh, hang on a minute, they're not there anymore.."
     
    RalphW, Nov 30, 2016
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  16. MikeParkin65

    MikeParkin65 Member Friend

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    Makes you wonder whether Tyseley might be better restoring something more loading gauge friendly than a third Castle. Perhaps a Jubilee for example.........
     
    MikeParkin65, Nov 30, 2016
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  17. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Let's stand back from this for a moment. VT puts forward a repeat itinerary at a similar time of year to 2015 and using a locomotive that they know has run before on the route without any difficulty. It also appears that the locomotive is not out of gauge and neither has there been any material change to the infrastructure. It is simply the fact that platforms that were previously available to the charter where the locomotive would fit are not available this year. So the trip cannot run. It is the only trip of its type from Birmingham to Lincoln and so passengers are being denied the opportunity to travel. What appears to have happened is that after the pecking order of service trains has been sorted out there was no space left to get the charter through Nottingham on a platform where 5043 would fit.

    So this does beg a few questions.
    • Is NR saying that Nottingham is not 'full', but platforms where the charter would fit are not available?
    • Did NR look at moving services to other platforms to create space?
    • Did NR look at whether any services could be retimed?
    We know that charters are last in the pecking order when it comes to track access but on the other hand, NR is required to provide track access in an even handed manner and look for solutions. It appears that they offered alternative routes. One wonders if at some point they also said that the charter could be pathed if it was diesel hauled in which case they could possible be accused of not providing 'open access'? All completely irrelevant as VT has cancelled but this business does make you wonder how hard NR tried to solve this particular problem.
     
    Big Al, Dec 1, 2016
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  18. alrohomer

    alrohomer Member Friend

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    Ben did say that they were given the option of using the 47.
     
    alrohomer, Dec 1, 2016
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  19. david1984

    david1984 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Hasn't helped WCRC with Leander/Galatea being out of gauge in a number of area's, how NR handle gauging procedure is what's at fault here.
     
    david1984, Dec 1, 2016
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  20. worldsteam

    worldsteam Member

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    Did anyone notice that RTT for a short period had two outward paths, which I thought, err, unusual! One was at Nottingham 0937/0938 and later at 1037/1039. I think the latter was a 'Q' path. Issue may have been how early does train start if is to get through Nottingham.
     
    worldsteam, Dec 1, 2016
    #20
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