Tornado to haul certain timetabled trains on S&C: Feb 14-16

An update on bookings. There are plenty of seats on the early morning Appleby to Skipton and the early evening return on all three days.
The morning Skipton to Appleby and afternoon return are fully booked.
Connecting buses from Carlisle all stations to Appleby now laid on.

 

With northern's lack of stock and generally poor service I would not be so sure that this will not be repeated, hing steam to run the S&C trains would release certain units for other functions, look what we have with the Class 37's on the Cumbrian Coast line.

 

Load 8 ?

 

Going to be interesting if northern start turning away 'normal' passengers due to overcrowding issues if the standing ban is enforced, its going to peeve a lot of normal travellers and from experience northern customer service regarding such matters is dreadful. Assuming that the trains are full from origin both ways is this not going to essentially severely reduce/remove the service for passengers at intermediate stations for the duration of the process?

 

I have sent you a pm.

 

It's only not allowed because people tend to do as they are told. If I buy a ticket to travel nowhere on that ticket does it say I have to use a seat and stay in it so if I want to stand by an open window to listen to the loco working that is what I will do, petty officialdom hiding behind the all pervading H&S will soon make life so safe it won't be worth living. I assume there is one guard on the train who has no power to make anyone sit down if they refuse.
One thought to these trains, what if a normal passenger wants to board at one of the intermediate stations? A bit unfair to turn them away because the train is full.

 

But isn't this mark 2 stock? I don't think there will be any open windows.

The last time I went on the 0947 there were four people in my coach beyond Settle. I'm sure Northern will have assessed this aspect. I feel a bit sorry for Alex, he tries to do something a bit innovative and gets zapped on a site like this.

Maybe the staff will have a few seats to use at their discretion for people who are 'obviously normals'.

 

It's not unfair to ask these questions. Northern Rail run a public service that people depend on. These people need to be assured that they will not be marooned because of a train full of enthusiasts. NR has a responsibility to get fare-paying passengers to their destination, even if it means relaxing the standing rule or laying on a bus to mop up passengers from intermediate stations.

 

There is massive potential for this to happen if contingency plans are not in place. It's not just about the small number of regular passengers that normally use the trains. There could be scores of enthusiasts and other local participants intending to board at intermediate stations.

I've no idea what special arrangements are being put in place. It would be good to hear what NR are planning.

 

You're talking as if the regular users will have had their heads buried in the sand. I suspect most folk intending to travel will realise that these services may well be chaotic and will adjust their plans accordingly. For the scores of enthusiasts / local participants who turn up specifically for a cheap ride behind steam - they have already been warned that it is first come first served and they might not get on, so they can't really complain if they don't!

When Harrods have a sale on I have to camp out overnight to guarantee getting the bargain I want, while the regulars expecting to turn up as usual will likely miss out. If I see signs indicating that there's some kind of event taking place that will affect the roads on my usual route to work, do I just expect things to run as normal, or do I adjust my plans? I regularly pop down to see my local non-league side play football and I see that they've drawn Arsenal in the next round of the FA Cup, should I just pitch up at the turnstile on the day and expect to get in as usual?

Some folk are going to be put out, that's simply the nature of these kind of events. It's a one-off, either enjoy the chaos, or keep well clear.

 

I think many will, but some may simply not have picked up on it, or registered that it is happening on those particular days.

For example, I was caught out by a recent Tube strike despite knowing in advance that it was going to happen - I just hadn't made the link, and had a 2 mile walk as a result.

As a timetabled train, if I were wanting to use the train from (say) Horton to Kirkby Stephen, I would be seriously put out if I found I couldn't travel in these circumstances. I do however agree that the numbers so affected are unlikely to be high.

 

That's why I said "Some folk are going to be put out". It's unfortunate for those people, but there are numerous events like this where folk are put out and that can range from a small number to vast numbers. Presumably, Northern feel that the pros will outweigh the cons.

 

I hope you're right (that local people will adjust their plans). And I hope Northern have some contingency plans for deserving cases.

Good luck to Sutton in the cup. What a great win against Leeds.

 

For what has been said on here, 7 coaches are being described as available in for passengers by Northern but 8 are on the train. The 8th may be the POB, but surely could also be the guard's brake, the seating of which may perhaps be being kept for use from other stations?

Steven

 

Only NatPres could find negativity and criticism in this event. How about some congratulations to Northern for having the guts to do something like this? There is a good article by Tony Streeter in Steam Railway this month that lists the many reasons and obstacles as to why we can't have timetabled steam - it serves to show what a unique event this is. I hope I am wrong, but I honestly don't think it will be repeated, the stars have aligned to provide circumstances that make it possible this time. Northern certainly won't be making any money out of this and that is driver behind any commercial operation. This is a big publicity stunt to get the S & C back into people's minds after the massive slump in passenger numbers following a landslide that would easily have shut the line not so long ago. I am sure locals will be getting behind these runs. They will certainly appreciate the extra trade, interest and are highly unlikely to be moaning that they may have a little difficulty getting a seat for a couple of days in February, off peak. This railway has taken an almighty hit in the last year, many people have thought the line was completely closed and passenger numbers have plummeted. As enthusiasts we should applaud that our greatest achievement to date (a brand new express steam locomotive), is being chosen to breathe some life back into our finest mainline, at its time of need. Please get behind it, enjoy it and I hope Northern and the A1 boys get some great publicity out of it.

 

Well there you go

If you do not comply with the requests of staff then they have every right to throw you off at the next station, valid ticket or not. Your ticket is issued subject to the national conditions of carriage and railway by-laws - it does not give the holder the right to do what they want. If the service is advertised as a 'no standing' one then by buying a ticket for that service, or even just boarding it, you are explicitly stating you will abide by that ruling.

However as you still don't seem to be able to understand the very sound reasons reasons for the no standing ban (or indeed why the railway industry requires window bars, etc.) then I suggest you save everyone a lot of bother and don't travel. Standing by an open window to 'experience' the sound of the motive power is not what the railways exist to do - particularly scheduled services. The sooner we get rid of opening droplights in non charter services the better.

Enthusiasts (in general) unfortunately have past form for not obeying the rules as regards sticking body parts out of windows, and as such they have bought the current restrictions upon themselves. Just because one individual swears blind they won't is no reason to change the rules however much the shout and whinge.

 

I am behind it. I've booked. I'm looking forward to it.

It's not negativity to question whether there are contingency plans in place for people who need to travel but can't get on the trains.

 

These runs are undoubtedly a great opportunity for people to experience Tornado on the mainline, for the many enthusiasts taking an interest and the regular commuters (some of whom will probably be unaware of the arrangement until their train turns up producing more smoke than usual ) alike. So with respect, can this thread not become another largely pointless argument about window hanging?