LMS 5699 The Winter Cumbrian Coast Express 4/3/17.

After Wednesday I'm glad that Galatea is going to show her stuff. Hopefully the rain shall have cleared by the time the train gets to Carnforth.

 

A very welcome development for @meltonnorth to provide such information. Many thanks!

 

Hear Hear!

 

Seconded

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Ditto. This is excellent, a new spirit of "glasnost" from RTC? I do hope so. It will sell a few more seats at the last minute and could make the difference between profit and loss on a tour.

 

I assume the gauging has been sorted out for the Jube's in both directions over the coast.

 

Or perhaps it is at least sorted southbound?

 

I did hear a story Re: gauging about the front steps and an angle grinder, but no idea if true ;-)

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Looks that way according to Melton, so good news, as we're travelling on the 25/3.

 

Heard the same today !

 

It's very good news if that issue is now finally resolved and I can only echo that the info from @meltonnorth is very welcome.

I wonder about the load though? Wasn't it supposed to be 11 for this one? I'm not sure a Jubilee will be going over Shap unassisted with 11 on?

 

If a Jube can climb the whole of Miles Platting at 18mph, Shap shouldn't cause two many problems given a clear run through Tebay.

 

Fingers crossed Liam!

 

Royal Scot has also failed on me, on the only trip booked on it, while Tangmere only failed on the last of 18 trips ( The ACE in 2011). I Think I will only do pay on the day ( if available )with either Scot in the future.

 

Much as I admire your response there is the world of difference between "a mile and a bit of very steep" from a standing start (after a gentle run) and "6ish miles of almost as steep" after a climb over Grayrigg and with an extra coach. It's not just about "grunt" it's about having the steam available to provide the grunt (at a meaningful speed). Jubilees were never renowned steamers - hence the experiments with double chimneys. But fingers crossed and let's hope everything goes well - it will be noisy!

As regards max unassisted loads, on this thread (and others), posters refer to a "Winter" limit as I was unsure what this meant I re-read NR's guidance about max loads for steam (issued May 2016) and found no reference to a "Winter limit". Loads are reduced during the "Leaf Fall Season" aka "Autumn" (15 Sep-31 Dec) - usually by 2 coaches - , but nothing specific for winter. Loads are further reduced on lines with "Significant Gradients" (greater than 1/100) and several but not all lines are listed. Where they are not listed TOCs are to contact NR. There may be other factors which limit max train lengths e.g. length of loops.

So with this trip (now a class 6) - it's not Autumn, so max would be 11 - BUT - north over Shap (significant gradient) this is reduced to 9. Operators can exceed this providing they carry out a thorough risk assessment (including historical data, crew experience, maintenance of loco, quality of coal etc.) For 46115 the max load would have been 10 and it is easy to see that an RA would suggest SG would be ok with 11. It is a bigger step with 45699 and I was not surprised when I saw Melton's first post that diesel assistance would be taken. So, come on Galatea, let the roaring begin!

Footnote: An interesting consequence of the guidance can be seen in the following. A class 6 hauled train north over the S&C to Carlisle then back south on the WCML running on 9 Sept (not "NR Autumn" and no "Significant Gradients") would have a max 0f 11. A train running in the opposite direction on 16 Sept would have a max of 7 (now Autumn and north over Shap is a "Significant Gradient") - could be increased subject to RA.

If I've got this wrong, I'm sure someone will tell me - but please be kind!

 

Those figures are the ones I was thinking of, but couldn't find where they were documented. For some reason I thought the limit was extended well beyond December into Feb or March, but must have got that wrong.

 

Seems like a lot of us were unsure, but I couldn't remember Winter being specifically mentioned. At the time I saved a copy to my PC but the documents are still available on line in the NR archive. I think that they may be on NP somewhere, but link may no longer be valid. If I remember, and providing no one has access to later guidance, I'll upload the files.

 

Les Ross well and truly fixed. Just thrashed through Leyland!

 

34067 did not fail on the ACE in 2011. Assuming you mean 9th July 2011.In fact it was very good all day. Dave Hewson got past Soton in 84m 14s, net 77 minutes for the 79.24 miles from Waterloo and was rather speedy down Roundwood. Pete Roberts ran up from Salisbury in 80 minutes net for the 83.7 miles with some fantastic acceleration away from checks