Ton up Tornado

That is always the case, halfway the stroke in a 2/4 cylinder locomotive and at 1/3 and 2/3 of the stroke in a 3-cylindetr version.
Kind regards
Jos Koopmans

 

Or maybe what was said was 'Take us to 83mph, we need a plus 10%' (on 75mph)
but what was understood was 'Take us to 83mph we need a plus 10% (as well, so that's about 90)

 

I am trying to remember where I came across reference to this trial. It was in English, it might have been on line, while looking for more information on the design than was contained in my book on compound locomotives. Thanks for the link to the German article - a translation is called for.
The results of these tests should help enthusiasts and others that might be interested to get some sense of the advantages an eight-coupled locomotive holds over a larger wheeled Pacific.
The P2 should hold such a high advantage over other available types it could become the default locomotive of choice where route considerations are not a factor.

 

The German interest in the NSB cl. 49 was mostly a continuation of the long standing controversy within the nationalized DR between the Wagner led Prussian dominant group advocating simple expansion locomotives (for the mostly flat northern Germany) against the designers from the local state railways in the mountainous southern part of Germany advocating compounds (e.g. Bavarian S3/6, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bavarian_S_3/6).

Thus the tests were mainly focused on the comparison between high degree superheat, simple expansion versus compounds. Not so much on the six coupled versus eight coupled.

The tables at the end of the German paper show that the NSB locomotive was not only more efficient at low speeds (as usual for compounds) but also at quite high rpm. This indicates a high degree of internal streamlining.

There is a very good Norwegian book about the Dovre Giants (http://en.nmj.eu/1008349.html?___store=de_en&___from_store=default), but it has only a brief 5 page summary in English.

From the book the following facts from the German tests can be summarized:

The tests were carried out during the period May-August 1940. At first a few steaming deficiencies were observed; the Krupp design had only a single chimney (while the Norwegian original had double), the damper openings were slightly small and the fire bars were designed for inferior Norwegian coal. The steam temperature was measured to 413 C (775 F). Front end adjustments were made at the DR Gruenewald test facility.

Road tests were carried out with the regular Berlin – Wroclaw (Breslau) express train, 336 km, scheduled timing 4 h 47 min, average 70 km/h. Normally these trains were run with the cl. 01 pacifics. (cl. 01; 109 ton, 130 km/h. cl 49; 99 ton, 100 km/h). The cl. 49 could take a 665 ton train over the route with an average speed of 76 km/h (gaining around 25 min over the schedule).

The German drivers reported the cl. 49 as very shure footed, aiding the rapid accelerations, adhesion weights; cl. 49; 62 tons, cl. 01; 59 tons (only 5% difference).

 

Here is a date for your diaries folks:


The programme will be on the iplayer for everyone to watch from 15th May. The makers are hoping for a national screening as well.
Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

 

The simple vs compound debate, not helped by the character and influence of Robert Garbe even though this was quite a few years earlier. The cl. 49 are very similar in some aspects of their design to the works of Karl Golsdorf, compounds built with a very close eye on the weight but capable of very good performance. It was a pity that the 49c was hamstrung by the inferior exhaust system fitted by Krupp. Even so the design of by far of the bulk of the machine was remarkable in many ways. Given what we know of the double Kylchap system, the humiliation one of these machines so fitted would have inflicted on the O1, though it might have delighted true locomotive enthusiasts, it would not have influenced either the DR or DB to reconsider their locomotive design policy. the parties on either side of the compound vs simple question were (and are) very entrenched. Even so the Maffei Pacifics hung on because simple expansion engines could not be designed to equal them for weight and power output.

I know about the Norwegian language book. I think that Camden still stock it. I need to obtain a copy. Many thanks to you for posting further.

 

I think something like that would only be in the national interest. A BBC2 or BBC 4 job maybe? Although if it was up to me I'd quite happily pull 'the one show' just to give it the airtime it deserves!

 

The Dovregubben was more potent than the 01 pacific in spite of prof Nordman telling otherwise.
The Norwegians scrapped most and put one in museum 1958.
The irony is that the best and last used steam locomotive in Norway was left german very austerity war locomotives baureihe 52.
Last regular run 1970.
Morale of the story:
4 pieces of 1.6 meter wheelsets are better than 3 sets of 2 meter.
But 5 wheelsets of 1.4 meter are more usefull than 4 of 1.6.
Compounding saves coal and boiler maintenance.
The best british loading gauge locomotive would have been a 9F with two inside compound cylinders and Kraus-Helmholz truck up front and flanged middle driving wheels.

 

Well there's an interesting idea! Deserves a thread of it's own, I think...

 

Err ........ok. So stuff your V4 and get on with this baby.

 

Hello Steamage

Might be fun and will You please start it?

 

Led to believe is also available Freesat 956 or Sky 978 according to another post from another forum.

 

Indeed it is, programmed to record!

 

One for iPlayer for me...

 

Just watched the program on BBC1. What a great program and well worth watching. Just a shame it wasn't shown across all regions of the U.K.

 

i-Player saying "available soon"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08rb16k

Tom

 

Just watched it on our regional programme. Very good, recommended. It didn't show the brake test but apart from that it did the job well.

 

Have just watched it too. Probably the best programme about trains I've ever seen. Plenty of technical stuff for the railfans, and lots of other snippets for ordinary folk. Well done to all concerned.

Why oh why was she routed through Darlington on the way south though? Talk about taking things to the wire for the 100mph attempt...

 

Agree that it was a good programme, well worth watching. No cliches or other typical reporting comments and dumming down. Plenty of anxiety as to whether it will make it. If we hadn't known what finally happened it would have been nail-biting. Even SWMBO stopped looking at her laptop and watched the later bits!

 

Agree with that, a first informative documentary from the BBC, watched it on Sky955. Interesting to see all the data recording equipment festooning the engine.