Heritage Line Loco Power Requirements

How does this proposal differ in any way whatsoever from the current situation? What restrictions are there currently preventing this from happening

To put it differently, where would you start? Which line is looking for a 45xx and which owner is looking for a home for their loco? If there's an obvious match, why hasn't it already happened?

 

I could have worded my post better as I didn't mean to infer there were no Class 3 locos at all in traffic but you have to admit that your list on its own would be insufficient to keep all heritage lines operational.

 

So what are said owners doing about it?

 

Oh absolutely, whenever anyone suggests the GWSR ought to look at buying a steam loco or two I'll always argue against it, there are so many advantages to it. With my original comment I more had in mind locos like 76077 where there's nothing fundamentally stopping restoration, yet it still rests in the northern headshunt as no agreement has been able to be drawn up between the railway and the owner that is satisfactory to both parties.

As I said, I don't know, but I imagine at least some of those prairies listed are in a similar situation, hence my comment about nationalisation, then locos could be allocate where they needed to be for the common good!

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It's hardly surprising that that arrangement on an inside-cylinder loco has pros and cons (like most things); but with outside cylinders it is of course unavoidable.

 

One point that has not really been addressed is that, with so many heritage lines dependent on Barry Scrapyard for motive power, it was a case of getting whatever was available. The later a given project started acquiring engines, the less choice was available. I wonder if a relative latecomer like the GWSR would have ended up with five GWR engines of class 5 or above if the project had started in the 1960s when small prairies or pannier tanks were available.

Actually, this point has been made by myself and others in response to suggestions by PaulH that preservationists cherrypicked the express locos from Barry before turning to the smaller ones - not true, most of the earlier examples to go were either the unique ones (e.g. B1, Q, 71000, 42968) the first examples of classes not already preserved S15, S & D 7F), or those most suited to heritage line use. It was only later on that the larger engines tended to be bought, because by then the choice was limited. His dislike of "bigchufferitis" seems to have blinded him to this reality.

 

This maybe so however having driven and fired them the 45xxs are definately a 3 and the 57xxs (classed as a 3 by BR) are very much a 4

 

And when you look at the history of Barry, a large number of small locos had been scrapped some considerable time before the s.g. heritage railway movement expanded beyond the early pioneers and thoughts turned to rescuing locos from scrap yards. If Woodhams had cut everything as quick as the other yards did, we wouldn't be having this debate as all we would have is the locos that were sold straight from BR into preservation and industrials. Whatever a person's thoughts on what is "ideal" motive power for a heritage railway, they should be grateful that we have what we have - a rich abundance of steam in all shapes, sizes and colours.

 

Barry wasn't the only source of motive power for new lines. In the early 80's the last engines came out of industry in South Wales and the collection went to the Welsh Maritime and Industrial Museum. They were placed on loan to various welsh lines. We (Gwili) had Welsh Guardsman and Haulwen from this source which between them have pulled about 90% of trains since 2001.

I think we might have suffered from "big chufferitis" from the one time we did visit Barry, coming back with a Manor but at the time the remaining small praries and panniers were inspected and were noted to be in poor condition.

Regards

Matt

 

Quite so but I'd wager that lines like the NYMR, SVR and NYMR would struggle with a fleet of Pecketts, Barclays et al.

 

Too right! I remember firing 'Austerity' 0-6-0 ST No. 193 in the early 1970s, at which time the SVR ran only the 4 1/2 miles to Hampton Loade. The trip does stick in my memory, but not for the right reasons.

I remember similar locos at Bickershaw colliery, and had a great respect for them and the loads they pulled. But they weren't suited to that kind of work.

 

The first line of this post doesn't make sense! Why argue against the railway owning locomotives if there are so many advantages to doing so?

I think there is a good argument for a railway owning at least part of is fleet. Doing so offers the opportunity to provide stability via a core fleet in a world where loco owners are fickle and most railways rely on steam as their main attraction. It will happen more and more as private owners struggle with escalating costs and/or their successors do not want to retain their engines.

 

If it does the Loco "...no Good at All,..." how does it still run day in day out as it were? (a look at the NYMR site shows pretty much the same 4 steam locomotives in use all summer so far.) A little bit more wear and tear is hardly justification for using something much bigger, or really something to be that concerned about if it wears out or breaks, fix it.

 

Ah I was wondering who'd spot that first Wilson! there are advantages and disadvantages of both of course, but some set ups suite different railways. GWSR for instance was a pretty late starter, but it could focus on track, carriages and facilities and not worry about expensive steam engines and leave other groups to look after that. Individual owners can be fickle, but loco owning groups with a membership or shareholders tend to be a bit more stable, as those folk will in all likelihood have connections with the home railway.

 

Ah, I knew about the latter but not the former, I was always lead to believe king George was the only steam loco we've ever owned outright. What has happened to those two locos out of interest since then?

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Robert Nelson No.4 moved to the Riverstown Mill Railway in Ireland circa 1997.

King George is at Didcot being converted into a ‘Thomas’. http://www.didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/locos/2409/2409.html

 

Gee, they certainly like butchering locos down at Didcot in order to make something else.

 

Fully in line with Swindon traditions. They never built a new locomotive if they had an old one that could be satisfactorily adapted.