Trawsfynydd and Blaenau Ffestiniog Railway

i'm not sure that's altogether the case. When I go for a visit , I look around to see what else is in the area. The more attractions in a locality, the greater likelihood I'll visit.

 

That echoes my thinking too. The 'saturation' argument has been kicking around since at least the 70's. The fact it's still alive and kicking makes me wonder whether I'm coming at this from a pure 'enthusiast' point of view as, presumably, 50 years experience of marketing lines must be showing that 'Joe Public' thinks in terms of "either/or", however, the notable example of the WHR (long opposed by the Ffesterbahn for this precise reason) tended to reinforce my long held suspicion that intense dislike/fear of competition lies at the root of the argument.

 

But that's you, as a railway enthusiast. General public would look at it the same way, though only 1 or 2 of the attractions they will look at are Railways. The area has a lot more non railway attractions.

 

And it's not just the "General Public" who might think that way. I'm a railway enthusiast, and each year we spend a fortnight in North West Wales. I wouldn't want to spend all the time there visiting railway attractions. Why?
1 I go on holiday with my wife and want to spend time with her, and although she has a passing interest in railway type things there are limits!
2 I can't afford to travel on that very many in the course of a week or so; in fact a journey together over the full length of the WHR would be beyond our reach.
3 I'm actually interested in many other things as well!
So each year when I'm there I aim to take a journey on my own, whether it be a part line journey on the F&WHR, a trip on one of the smaller lines, or a trip on one of the "Big Railway" lines in the area. Then I'll also spend a day on my bike taking photos lineside somewhere.
Having another railway attraction won't change any of that, it would just mean that my meagre spend gets spread more thinly.

Now that's just a personal view, and as we all differ it's not a reason to not develop another railway.

Steve B

 

Nevertheless, I hope they retain whatever remains of the trackbed, as a footpath if nothing else.

 

If that were to be it's fate, let Sustrans have it. They're very territorial indeed, to the extent of enjoying making life difficult for rail reconstruction projects right up to ministerial level.

 

All railway preservation starts somewhere and a number of now successful lines have made it after joining preservation later than others, although others have indeed fallen by the wayside. If these guys / girls are serious then they should be supported by fellow preservationists with positive advice (often gained by bitter experience) rather than being given 100 ways they are going to fail. If people are prepared to give time (a valuable commodity), energy and effort into a project then I for one wish them luck in their venture.

 

No point in supporting a project just because it's a railway. If a blind man on a galloping horse can see that it's in the wrong location/has too much competition/is being unrealistic about objectives etc etc. then realism has to come to the forefront. I can't see why we would support something like Alf Roberts' Luton-Dunstable railway, just because it's a railway project, when everyone can see the folly of such a scheme.

On the other hand if the scheme has reasonable prospects then yes, we should all get behind it.

I believe the posters on NP already distinguish between these 2 types of projects and encourage where appropriate.


Keith

 

There will be no shift from private to public transport in the future unless self drive cars become a reality. There is no logical argument that supports such a switch.

 

If self drive cars become a reality the shift to public transport will be to self driving taxis (no driver to pay, therefore much cheaper).

 

Around here (West Yorkshire) there has already been a big increase in the use of the railways. In fact some of our lines are running at capacity in peak hours.

I disagree that there is no logical argument for a switch. A rapidly increasing population, and increased car ownership, are causing an exponential increase in congestion. With the right investment, public transport will become far more attractive.

The "right investment" would include such things as LRT for West Yorkshire, a far better investment for the region than HS2 or HS3.

Apologies, this is well off topic.

 

Urban areas will always be dependent on public transport; that doesn't apply to the area under discussion. It is WIBN territory to think we will see a network of new or rebuild railways in lightly populated areas such as the one under discussion.

 

Velo rails have been mentioned above. To be suitable a line needs to be relatively flat as peddling up hill can take a lot if fun out of it. Passing is rarely a problem. Most people are not in a hurry and there are usually happy to cooperate in helping others remove their trolley if needed. There are usually rules as to who gives way to whom.

 

Especially a line such as the one under discussion that was originally built for long-gone business strategy reasons, rather than as a public transport system.

 

Nevertheless, I hope they preserve the trackbed just in case.

 

I disagree. My view is that many of the current crop of 'new' preservation schemes (whether realisable or not) seem to have an element of ego, people wanting to have their own 12"/ft train set and be their own metaphorical Fat Controller. There are enough existing preservation projects crying out for the energy and enthusiasm of new people who want to get into railway preservation - there is always now the question of how much railway preservation is actually sustainable, both financially (Aysgarth immediately springs to mind) and in terms of how many bodies they can attract to do the behind-the-scenes drudge.

Unfortunately things like the very public WSR saga - in which few, if any, people seemed to emerge with much credit - can be very off-putting to people who want to join existing projects. Nevertheless, I still believe that if those who want to start a new project would channel it into existing projects, railway preservation as a whole would be better off. Quality not quantity.

(And I include a good 50% of the current fashion for 'new build' loco schemes in that)

 

Good God. The amount of negativity on this long running thread is astonishing. Let them make a sincere attempt before condemning gents, unless of course someone has an agenda and doesn't want to see trains return there. Hmmm.

The line is safeguarded anyway, due to decommissioning of the nuclear plant. Its not going anywhere. Its a nice run overall.

Who knows the future in the long-term? Thanks to its remoteness, most of the trackbed that was dismantled is untouched except in two places, and the line could feasibly divert around them. Its not impossible engineering-wise. Unless land ownership is an issue. It may go beyond Trawsfynydd, over Cwm Prysor Viaduct, and if someone figures out how to right the wrongs of the Liverpool City Council, carve its way around the Llyn Celyn towards Bala Junction. Maybe we can even dream of a future connection with Llangollen railway there as well.

One thing is certain. Nothing will happen if everyone sat round and whined all day long.

 

It strikes me that if the T&BF can successfully identify and develop a market, it would be most likely by growing the overall number of visitors the area. Surely Llyn Trawsfynydd is a significant leisure resource in it's own right. Is developing it as such beyond the wit of the local tourist sector?

 

Drive down the road & you've got Bala Lake , complete with an expanding narrow gauge railway running along the lakeside. They also don't need another railway in their area.
Any suggestion about joining up with the Llangollen Railway is ridiculous. The railway will never proceed west of Corwen.

Bob.