Churchward County Project

I'm 100% with you on this one. The project to chop a Cockerill tram loco into a J70 is one which makes me uneasy. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see a J70 (preferably without one of those bl--dy silly faces on it!), but destroying another historic loco to do it grates with me.

 

I agree with you entirely on this point. I am a little uncomfy about destroying one thing to create another. I'd also argue that it is unnecessary when you consider that there are other new build projects that are entirely new build, so it isn't as if it is impossible to manufacture the parts you are taking from the loco you are destroying.

But I do recognise that a complete new build is more expensive/time consuming.

I can't help but wonder what in 50 years time the preservation movement will think about the decisions made now. Much as we lament the failure to preserve say Ben Alder or Moel Tryfan. 'The failure to preserve a Pacer is a national disgrace'

 

If you are really missing the excitement of a ride in a Pacer pop along to Butterley as they've been inflicting one on their passengers for at least 2 years.
Ray.

 

A Pacer (or two) should be preserved in working order .... if for no other reason than to ensure it never happens again!

"Ben Alder" was a very sad loss (surely BR had a few redundant rail connected sheds in locations no-one wanted to redevelop? - Ho-hum!) ... but we've got another thread for that!

To be honest, the 'Rough Rider' wouldn't have made page 1 of my personal list of even GW subjects for recreation (a 'Metro' tank or 'Aberdare' would be higher on that list, ahead of the pin-up 3031 class), but -Hey! - there are evidently many want to see one and it's their money, so if they can do it .... and at least it's not getting yet another (yawn) 'royal' themed name .... the very best of luck to them!

 

A “Rough riding” gala day springs to mind, with a choice of the County 4-4-0 or Pacer........

 

A working Dean Goods surely has to be on someone's radar. They don't come much more iconic, do they?

So far as the GW 'recreations' are concerned, my own view is that this is merely the fruit of Churchward's standardisation. A de-knackered stray boiler seems a reasonable enough use for something which would otherwise sit around rusting away. Many 'donor' locos have sat around for decades, so it's not as though this was ever 'Option 1' on anybody's list.

Where space exists to display locos 'awaiting restoration', all well and good, but there's a lot of working kit in dire need of undercover storage and as unpalatable, in this context, as it may be, that's surely where any given railway's finite resources of time, effort and money have to be directed. Going beyond that dictates a dedicated group not detracting from the core business of keeping the trains running.

In the case of 'designs which never were' (a certain WSR mogul comes to mind), there's a line to be drawn between those seriously proposed - or a spec drawn up - and total flights of fancy. The latter, IMO, are fine..... if someone with the requisite skills and sufficiently deep pockets starts with a blank sheet, though I'd agree that existing locos shouldn't be quarried for components for such projects. As luck would have it, that won't affect 36006 in the slightest, though psychiatric reports just might!

 

Please don't mention "new build" and "D*** G***s" in the same sentence. The scars have only just healed from last time it was discussed here ...

Tom

 

The project started out as the 3 counties project so the county tank will come later perhaps ?

 

Whoops! I expected something from your direction Tom...... but about the last sentence!

 

My comments about Pacers are in jest. But plenty of things that were disliked at the time seem to have found fashion now - Quadarts as a star attraction etc. I just wonder if in 50 years time people will be as forgiving of the decisions our generation is making as we are of the early preservationists (as has been mentioned lack of space, lack of money etc as to why some things weren't preserved).

It is interesting because Ben Alder was not saved in part because it wasn't deemed original enough, and yet now we have no problem with the cannibalisation of locos to build new locos. I've no idea what the attitudes to what is acceptable will be in later years - the County Project might be held up as an example of what should be done, or it could be held up as a destructive travesty.

I do feel as if the question 'is this wise?' (echoing Sgt Wilson) is not asked often enough.

 

yep History will judge us

 

And it may well judge us as being too keen to spend money on rebuilding heaps of scrap that duplicate surviving locomotives, and not nearly keen enough on building the long term infrastructure that will be necessary to enable them to survive indefinitely.

 

Isn’t there a jinty at Butterly which has been in pieces for years and never looks like ever doing anything? How about using that as the basis for a Johnson/Deeley 3F? The Midland standard 8 foot plus 8 foot 6 wheelbase is common to both so 5he frames could be used?

Just thought Id throw it in as an idea.....

 

More broadly short termism over thinking long term. You can say that this issue is not a new issue where railways are concerned.

 

While it's up to each of us how we choose to waste/invest our own money, the point about infrastructure is well made.

I honestly doubt the day when hindsight doesn't suggest any generation could have done things differently will ever arrive!

 

It's a bit like a 'sawn off' saint class....

Chris

 

Not just hindsight. Foresight is quite good at this as well!

Paul H

 

I'm sure that many are scratching their head thinking the same thing. I would offer that considering how large GJC loomed on the British locomotive landscape, the number of express passenger locomotives still extant that can be directly attributed to Him is rediculously few, (and the number that have, or are likely to run again in preservation is fewer still!). It is probably inevitable that the idea to recreate an extinct class of GJC's will gain some gravitas amongst enthusiasts with a certain leaning.

Now you are playing some sweet, sweet music Howard! I do have a soft spot for the 3800 class though, ever since Mr Claus left one under the tree c.1984!