LSWR T3 563

I don’t think the current dead hand of the DfT resting on the shoulders of railway managers, would allow any legendary Managers like Herbert Walker to reappear!

 

This is thread drift but for example we have a 313 in a BR lite livery and a 66 in large logo, but GWR repainted only single power cars and not a whole set in either the BR or Inter-City livery.

Does anyone own the rights to any colour schemes? I'm assuming not as I can't think of any preserved railway that has been challenged over colour schemes etc use.

 

I believe they wanted to repaint a whole train, but were thrwated by the disability discrimination action. This states that train doors need to be a contrasting colour, to help the visually impaired find them.

 

That is interesting because the 313 has been repainted in BR blue with different door colours which I don't think looks too bad. So it can be done.

Although no double arrows?

 

I don't agree. Enthusiasts are pretty much the only ones who would know the difference between a mk1 and an earlier coach.

 

That's because the interior of any bogie coach from the 1930's onwards will in effect have the same layout, OK different fixings, different standards of comfort, but to the uninformed there will be more than a passing resemblance between say a 1930's Open third to a 1950's Mk1, Coach design always as evolution more than revolution until the advent of the monoque Mk 2 which in turn was developed into the mk 3 and that of course lead in turn to the basic design of what we have today

 

yes I know.

 

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Didn't the Ise of wight 4 vec and 3 tic units have plain grey doors originally when in plain blue ?

 

I think the general public are a lot more discerning than you give them credit for.

I know the KESR used to experience people not getting on the MK1 train, and instead waiting an hour to go on the vintage train instead.

Also at NYMR I’ve seen family groups asking the guard if they are allowed on the teak train, without paying a special supplement. They can obviously see its a lot more special than the MK1s.

I’ve lost count of the number of ‘normals’ I’ve heard talking about the Dunkirk film, saying the railway carriage used was too modern.

I can think of plenty more examples too.

 

Hard to tell. I know a guard on the Ffestiniog and he was telling me that several times passengers have thought that the new coaches were for first class passengers and he had to explain that they weren't. He's had people ask him if they need to pay extra to travel in the open carriages and in the bug boxes (back when they were in more regular use). Generally I think a 'different looking' carriage is maybe seen as being something special and may lead passengers to treat it differently.

The T3 on the 4TC would be a money spinner.

 

Believe originally all over blue, then all over blue with grey doors and then blue/grey with grey doors. This pic from Wikipedia shows the latter two variants. They would go into NSE after this.

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No the great British and other members of the public have an eye for something different to the run of the mill MK1. Granted though there is a percentage who wouldn't know their backside from their brain putting it politely......

Too true Stephen, as a member of both the NYMR and the LNERCA [the association behind the operational teaks] when out fundraising folk ask does it cost extra, to ride? Answer No! Apart from the First class section [£3-£4 per head one way]. I've had many remark, What 3rd class, these are better than a 1st class MK1

 

Mm, only up to a point. I'd probably agree that there's a reasonable majority of people that wouldn't notice the difference between an early Mk1 with all wooden panelling and and pre-nat coaches with exterior metal panelling. After that I'm less sure. Anything with wooden panels, especially if just varnished but even painted and people notice, once you're down to 4-wheelers and/or coaches without corridors I think it's hard to tell who would and wouldn't at least notice, even appreciate, the difference.

 

well there's precious few of them in ordinary service. I bet almost no one notices the single Bulleid coach in a Swanage or Mid Hants rake unless they are an enthusiast to some level or other. Most people will only have eyes for the steam loco on the front

 

Rubbish. The only thing I agree with you on is your comment on the Bulleid Coach, you're probably right there. But the SVR and NYMR with their teaks, IoW, Bluebell, KWVR, there's plenty around. People *do* look at the carriages, and to think otherwise is blinkered. I'm looking to use the word Gricer here, but I'm sure a certain Mr Hitch will be onto you about that!

 

Bulleids and mk1s do look similar from the outside to the untrained eye.

However the interiors of the Bulleids do seem to attract passengers away from the 1970s upholstery, plastic panelled mk1s.

‘Let’s go in this one, it looks more authentic’ was a comment I heard once. Also ‘what a grotty modern thing, the next coach looks nicer’

 

Absolutely, the upholstery and panelling will make or break a Mk1 interior!

 

It's not rubbish,it's my opinion based on observation. I've travelled to most of the lines in the country over the past three years and the normal coach in service is a Mk1, even on the lines you quote (except the IOWSR, not been there anyway) . The only pre 1948 coach I have actually ridden in in all that time is said Bullieds at Swanage and MHR (which I sought out and Joe Public wouldn't know to do so) and an LMS rake at the Severn Valley which was a few weeks ago and was very comfortable, much more so than the last GWR coach I rode in which was the GWS rake to Torquay decades ago..

 

While you are waiting for the T3, a Standard 4 and a T9 are putting on a good show at Swanage today...

Robin

 

Gosh - a post that mentions 563...

Thanks, and nice photos by the way.

Steve B