West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Class 33 on the WSR now on Train Sim World, when will they do a Manor? BTW did they work with DEPG?

 

https://www.wsra.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/4110-Joint-Statement.pdf

 

That’s looks great.

 

If they let you borrow them, then are they a tender fender bender mender lender?

Would you render your tender fender?

 

Should be a good move; benefits of Gift Aid when possible on donations, WSRA vat registered for expenditure. Making every pound put in achieve more.

Hopefully a decent Agreement will be made between WSRA & WSR Plc.

 

Excellent news, that's how to work together! I also welcome the recognition that the WSR's structure is already overly complicated - first step to solving a problem is recognising you've got one!

 

Surely, it's not down to the Plc & the WSRA to make that decision, it's the people that are purchasing it!!! I would not want the WSRA to get hold of it, they haven't done much with the ones they already have & they are a declining organisation.

DJB.

 

Why is nothing ever straightforward in Somerset?

 

So people have pledged money to one organisation (‘4110 loco group’) to buy 4110, and WSRA now think they have an automatic right to take that money instead?

 

This looks very positive, but do those who organised the appeal agree that contributions should be paid to the WSRA, which will then take ownership, rather than form a separate body for this purpose and make the WSR family even more complicated?

 

OMG!!!! Get a grip people! You save 20% on VAT, 25% extra for GiftAid, no extra admin costs of another company, and it ought to bring the Plc and the WSRA closer too. And the end result is the same with better securities all round, what's not to like?

I think this is evidence that if peace is ever to break out over in Somerset, you really do need to dissolve the pan-railway organisations and start again. That way it'll be impossible to grind an axe against the WSRA or whoever, because they won't exist any more and there'll be new groups with no history or baggage. You can't claim that this isn't needed whilst people are up in arms about one WSR organisation buying a loco off another WSR organisation on better terms than it could be done any other way.

 

In many ways a sensible solution. However it’s not necessarily what people signed up to when they made their pledges.

The impression I got was that a company would be set up to purchase 4110. Presumably major contributors would therefore own a stake in the loco, get a say in its future, and be entitled to proceeds from any future sale.

Now people are simply being asked to make donations towards the purchase, with the WSRA retaining full ownership. Donors will only receive a years free WSRA membership in return.

So just because people have pledged £100k,it doesn’t mean they will all be happy to donate this to the WSRA instead.

 

Fair point, and I forget that I still can't get my head round being on a railway and not belonging to the main support organisation, on many railways I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone willing to donate to such a loco fun who wasn't a member of the main support group anyway, as such it wouldn't be as much of an issue.

 

I guess the point being made is that 1. the impression conveyed by the appeal was that pledgors would be acquiring shares in a company which owned the loco proportionate to their investment , and 2. it is not obvious what the locus of the plc and WSRA to jointly decide the terms and nature of the sale is, if that agreement(?) was made without involving the parties with the cash in that decision. If it was originally the plc's intention to require a purchase through the WSRA, then the persons leading the appeal would presumably have been apprised of that beforehand, which suggests this is a recent decision/suggestion. But who knows, perhaps all the pledgors think this is a welcome development?

 

A few words from the 4110 people on the news page.

Steve

 

So the 4110 group have enough money pledged to buy the loco. However the WSR have now suddenly decided they don’t like this solution, and another appeal has been started by the WSRA asking people to raise another £100k to buy the loco.

Meanwhile the original 4110 group is keeping hold of its £100k in case the new WSRA appeal fails?

 

I was starting to think that this was good news then the normal WSR muddle and farce comes along to change my mind!

 

The way I read it is that the 4110 group cough up the cash and spit the loco straight into WSRA's mitts. How many of the pledges are going to be withdrawn?

 

Pretty simples really. If both the PLC and WSRA have suggested to give your money to the WSRA to secure the locomotive for the future, give it to the WSRA.

As someone has said earlier, do we need yet another organisation in the already overcrowded railway family? What real benefit would this bring?

We should be grateful to the 4110 Ltd chaps who have got it this far, but I’m glad the railway management has recognised that the objective can be achieved in a more efficient and ‘one railway’ manner.

I don’t quite understand why 4110 Ltd continue to ask for the money in light of this afternoon’s joint WSRA / PLC statement. Perhaps one of the new Directors could clarify - at least one is known to contribute regularly to this forum

 

For all the reasons stated - ease of VAT recovery, Gift Aid being claimed, belonging to an established organisation committed to supply any locomotives it owns to the West Somerset, the arrangement revealed today by WSRplc and WSRA seems the perfect plan - you could even say, in effect, the WSRA gets to 'give' WSRplc cash when it needs it but gets a steam loco in return so it is a 'fair' and permitted transaction.

But, really, did no-one think to check that the promoters of the original Appeal would go with that, or, if they did, why on earth would they not have agreed? I suspect the situation will now be that some pledges will instead go to the WSRA, they may well obtain extra donations but the risk is neither group will have sufficient funds. Of course, the WSRA already has cash and could probably 'make up the difference' but that is hardly the point.

After what happened with 4160 (and similar incidents elsewhere), is it surprising that a separate, private company does not inspire WSRplc, who may be accepting a reduced price to keep the loco on the line.

I am disappointed that the previous structure appears to be aiming to continue in competition - whether I should be disappointed that this is due to lack of consultation with them or due to their reaction to the WSRplc/WSRA proposal, I lack the information to know but past experience of West Somerset and its ability to turn everything into the latest battle in a long-running war between entrenched factions, I should not be surprised. The very Railway itself may yet be a casualty if no ceasefire proves possible - and if the present circumstances don't lead to one, then I don't know what will!

Steven