Welsh Marches Express (Saphos Trains) 20/7/19 and 7/8/19

I can sympathise ! -- Having relocated from Wrenbury to Steel Heath this morning because of cloud, the cloud followed me south - should have stayed put !
Burgs Lane was sunny but despite the cooler day there's little exhaust to be seen.

 

OK. Just spoken to the diesel driver. He didn't have the '47 in drive at all. Should have timed it. 45 over Llanvihangel.

 

Next time, you'd better time it and *then* ask the driver.

 

Did at Crewe before we left!!

 

Nobody likes having the diesel on a steam tour, we try wherever possible to give the customers what they paid for. Modern railway does make it difficult at times.

 

The afterglow of sunset as it left Shrewsbury this evening.

 

A stunning photograph!!!

 

Nowt to do with the modern railway unless I've missed something. It wasn't an arduous path with recovery time at the water stops. The only issues have been with the choice of locomotive. Braunton without a diesel had no problems on 4th May. The Brit can't run Crewe to Hereford without an intermediate stop for water. That's the only difference. Can't work out the need for the diesel at all. The Brit hasn't been lumbered with the diesel 'up north' running from Crewe to Carlisle over Grayrigg and Shap then back via the S&C and Wilpshire; or both ways over the S&C. There were more than a small number of passengers not happy with the diesel in the consist both on the 20th July and yesterday.

 

The diesel was on the back to supply on board power as the as the generator car was unavailable ,also they used it to turn the whole train at Cardiff . where were you on the train because i didn't here anybody moaning about the diesel

 

As Mr. 1020 Shireman already knows because he was the first to mention it before he or the Brit had joined the train. <BJ>

 

I had hoped to post a report on the trip today but a couple of things cropped up, will post at the weekend.

 

Yes I read that and he knows why but why moan about it ,so how was the train to operate with no power?.

 

Talking to passengers on both Crewe and Cardiff stations. Wouldn't have mentioned it otherwise. What do you expect me to do, take their names and list them? 2 LSL folk told me there was nothing wrong with the Generator Car. The whole train wasn't turned on 20th July and the consist was the same. Go figure.

 

Are you sure it wasn't you talking to other passengers about your dislike for a diesel in the consist? Perhaps they wouldn't have considered it otherwise.

Your options for travelling on steam charters are diminishing. First of all it was Vintage Trains, then it was the Torbay Express and now it's Saphos.
I hate to think what you will do if RTC ever add a diesel to your charter.

None of us here at Nat-Preservation would opt to travel on a steam charter with a diesel tagging along at the rear, or even worse at the front, but here we are in 2019 over 50 years after BR steam ended.
The railways have moved on and we have to accept that steam charters have to work alongside the modern railway system. <BJ>

 

The diesel undertook the turning move to Maindee and back to ensure the steam led both ways and provided power to the set on this occasion unless the YouTube video I saw yesterday is out of date? Doesn't sound like it did anything else aside from the booked diesel ECS legs to/from Preston.

 

Quite the opposite. People were talking on the platform while I walked from The Brit up to Coach D. Of course you know otherwise because you were there weren't you?
Our options are diminishing, so what? It doesn't stop us booking and travelling when the trains are steam hauled as advertised. Shame about Vintage as we love Castles and Halls. Don't book RTC tours with diesels and can easily find out which ones those are. I've not written off Saphos. We've had 2 great runs with them this year, the first Welsh Marches and the first English Riviera. Sad the Brit wasn't allowed out on its own on the other 2 Marches. All I said about TBEL was that I won't book in advance again, certainly not in July or August.

Since 30th August 1984 have managed to travel a few times steam hauled here in the Uk, 898. Right from day 1 we made good contacts in the charter business. Spent many happy hours talking about the trials and tribulations of running and timing trains on the mainline with the Staite family, Mel Chamberlain of Days Out, Roger when Kingfisher ran trains, Marcus when he ran The Green Train and Steam Dreams, as well as Peter at Pathfinder Tours. Also knew a Railtrack/NR Timer and still have good contacts now. Quite amazed steam hauled charters are still running. Glad they are as from 1984 this had been my steam age as due to where I was born and lived until 1968 I missed the first one.

2019 has had it's ups and downs and so far we've only done 15 proper steam tours out of 26 booked. Lost 6 to cancellations and 5 to diesels. Have 12 more booked until end of the year so hopefully we can get to our min target of 25.
As long as tours proper steam hauled tours run we'll support or try to do 25-30 a year. The reason I like this site is we can all express our views and find out what others' think about the scene these days. Mine aren't made unless they are informed as well as they can be. Have a pop if you like. I'm thick skinned, but I find remarks like this both patronising and offensive:
Are you sure it wasn't you talking to other passengers about your dislike for a diesel in the consist? Perhaps they wouldn't have considered it otherwise..

 

On 4th May and 20th July only the locomotives were turned on Maindee Triangle.

Its a real conundrum whether or not diesels are working. In drive, or notch 1, the Class 47 doesn't make much more noise than running on ETH. ETH rev levels are higher than tickover. I had to leave the train at Ludlow and sound from the Class 47 was a neither here nor there sound. Not the deep throb of the big diesel on tickover and it certainly didn't push the train out as it would have needed to be on notch 2 if it was doing that. Its the performance that confuses. On Wednesday we topped Stretton Bank at 33, pretty much what would be expected with load 13. On July 20th with the same consist the summit speed was 46, doable but at the very top of a Brit's capabilities with load 13. Llanvihangel Southbound was more iffy. On the 20th July we topped the summit at 39; on Wednesday faster at 43/4. The diesel driver told me in Crewe that he'd assisted on both banks on the 20th. In Cardiff on Wednesday he said he hadn't had the Brit in drive at all. Very obvious on Stretton but not on Llanvihangel. The other interesting thing I've gleaned from drivers of the diesels is they don't consider drive/notch 1 to be assisting as they couldn't push the weight of train in front of them (355 tons of carriages + 125 tons of locomotive and tender) up a bank without the steam loco doing most of the work. None of the recordings show a plume of smoke off the Class 47's exhausts which you will get on notch 2 and above. There was no assistance when we were checked to on the 1in95 between Cwmbran and Pontypool, nor coming away from Signal SB115; both occasions caused by us being close to the Manchester. Llanvihangel North was virtually identical on both the 20th July and Wednesday. What one toyed with on those climbs was whether a Brit with 13 and a bit behind would top the summit at 44 on both occasions, as fast as Braunton did with the 11 carriage set on the 4th May. Answers on a postcard...

 

Postcard. You need more data. For example 70000 on the Fellsman--- 40 min at Hoghton (starting speed at Bamber Bridge 35), 46 at Selside NB 43 at Ais Gill SB. Lakelander 38 at Shap Summit. Then make some adjustments for gradients and loads.

PS My impression is that 70000 is in the mix for loco of the year.

 

None of the northern data helps as all have been with the 11 coach train. No diesel replacing the Generator Car.

Agree the Brit should be in the mix for loco of the year from its exploits up north. Unfortunately we couldn't get on a Fellsman or Lakelander this year. Perhaps this year we can petition to bring in the NATS properly and come up with data based nominations for locomotive of the year; railtour of the year etc. Being a good year so far for performance from what's been posted on Nat Pres and in the magazines.

 

Can you imagine how bad it would be if the steam tour you were travelling on ended up with a diesel in the consist and the person you were sat next to was 'not very happy' about the fact? It would be hell. <BJ>