Bulleid Pacifics - Past or Present

This is part of the confusion from when the LMS classifications were reviewed by BR and - in some cases - uprated. The Jubilees were originally classified 5XP (5 Express Passenger) and - being painted red - were identified as Red 5s in comparison to the Black 5s (i.e. 5MT Mixed Traffic) also designed by Stanier but became 6P5F under BR's reviewed classification. Similarly the Patriots were LMS Class 5P until BR classified them 6P5F but note that the rebuilt Patriots / Jubilees and Royal Scots were further re-classified 7P once released with the new boiler.

 

Many thanks, Fred.

 

The question I was answering to originally was about the perceived shortage of 8P locos, so on that, I did not add others engines, for instance of those mentioned by others, which are rated as 8p ?

 

The new Clan will have some improvements so will be at least much nearer to a Class 7, probably the full equal of a Class 7.

 

Bit of thread drift going on here.

 

As this is a thread on Bulleid Pacifics, can you please tell me when Bulleid designed the Clan?

 

Well it's almost a rebuilt light pacific with normal wheels, that's close enough isn't it?

 

I was half expecting someone to come back with the design date for Clan Line.

 

Will it be possible to see both do Settle Carlisle summit with equal load?
Loco mass is more or less the same
The very important question , is two better than three, can then be answered.

 

Timeless...

Tom

 

Sorry for my part in continuing (but not starting) the thread drift.
In answer to the question, one might argue that Bulleid, by introducing a class of light pacifics, provided a small part of the inspiration for the Britannias and the Clans.

 

At a time when further electrification might have been a better use of the railways money? for instance, on the Southern, much was already electrified, or planned to be, and Bulleid had already planned an electric locomotive and diesel locomotive, to build a large number of Steam locomotives does not make sence.

 

An early Raworth/Bulleid designed electric locomotive.

 

I imagine the plan would have been to extend 3rd rail to Weymouth, and Exeter and to use Electric locomotives on these longer routes, where shorter/ stopping routes would use EMU'S and to eliminate steam from the entire region.

 

I believe that Bulleid expected the outer arms of the LSWR - especially in Somerset and Devon - would not justify electrification hence would continue to use steam traction. Given the numerous classes then in use Bulleid proposed his light (axle load) Pacifics as the new replacement standard locomotive for these lines, accepting that the lack of economy on the "branch line" services would be offset by reduction in spares held plus the economy of operation on the main line services. In reality the experiments with diesel traction in the post-war era suggested an alternative and the departure of Bulleid to Ireland brought development of the light Pacifics as the new standard locomotive to a halt. In that sense the ordering of Clans for Southern Region services may have been an attempt to follow through with Bulleid's concept but within a national fleet plan rather than a local (SR) fleet plan.

 

A view which is rather confirmed when one looks at the direction taken by OVSB on the CIÉ, When considering the reliability (more accurately, the unreliability) of his CIÉ 1st gen internal combustion locos - principally the notorious Crossley 2 stroke lumps - Bulleid can't be blamed for the currency reserve situation in Eire which dictated purchase of British (i.e. priced in Sterling) diesels over the more reliable (but priced in Dollars) US units.

When thinking about early diesels, here too, national foreign currency reserves (and conttrols) were a major consideration in the immediate postwar period.

 

This weekend is the MHR steam gala. On arriving at Ropley and popping up stairs to the viewing area where the sale stands are located for this event. I noticed someone selling hats with 34058 on them. Which I purchased from the group sales stand. On asking is there any update on said loco I was told that some work is being done to the loco to help preserve it. This work includes the driving wheels being cleaned and then painted in to black gloss. Plus the tender wheels have been cleaned up ready for painting. All small steps but going in the right direction and possibly one day we will see 34058 in steam.

 

Yes, the 80150 group are utilising the conservation skills, honed on the most wonderful of Std 4 tanks, on Sir Fred when opportunity and manpower permits.

 

Also at the Mid Hants on the stairs leading up the old goods shed at Alresford. One day I hope to see it attached to the loco and heading off up over the Alps.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

 

24hrs and no Hemhorroid jokes....