West Somerset Railway General Discussion

I'm sorry to hear all that. Why is everybody else (SVR, NYMR, IoWSR, NNR, K&ESR just to name a few that come to mind) able then to re-open? Better management, perhaps?

 

I read this some time ago and reckoned no WSR charity could apply and use it to prop up the WSR's independent operating company. Then I saw the SVR announcement and wondered how their charity managed to prop up their independent operating company. If they can do it then why not the WSR? Hence the quest to spot the differences.

BTW looked again at the HLF webpage and I still can't see the bit that covers propping up another non-charitable commercial company by paying wages. Help me out, folks. Having staff working working have made all the difference to reopening the WSR this summer.

Not trying to suggest anyone has done anything wrong. Just trying to fathom out the "how".

Steve

 

Maybe ask the other non-opening railways too? Just to get a more rounded view of "why".

Steve

 

Surely it is just about how you describe the outcome. So if charity x says “we are giving a grant to pay the wages of staff in loss-making company y” that is problematic. But if instead it says “we are giving a grant for the restoration and maintenance of Loco A within the workshop of company y” which enables the company to pay salaries within its workshop of those engaged in the work, then I can’t see the problem. The charity is still meeting its charitable objectives, and probably more cost-effectively than if instead it contracted out the equivalent work to a workshop off the railway.

Tom

 

I agree, there are other railways that have come out and said that they are not opening and more no doubt will. It isn’t just a WSR thing.

regarding the lottery, You have to have received a previous grant from the HLF. I don’t think the Plc have but the WSST did receive a recent award. Perhaps they could apply, the fund closes on 31st July. A number of heritage lines have received grants with a few more possibly to come. Nothing ventured etc.

Regards
Matt

 

That is first hand confirmation of the suitability of open stock being successfully used to comply with social distancing, something many here disparaged. More ventilation and easier to clean I am sure.
The DSR has no one to interfere or to argue with, hence their success.
You can see why the WSR PLC may wish to further that idea. You cannot run a successful enterprise when factions are stirrup up the pot. This has been tried on the WSR - and it seems has spectacularly failed. I believe it is only the dedication of their volunteers that have managed to keep the line operating. The 'one railway' mantra was a smokescreen, which sadly, many accepted.

 

Most of the railways not opening seem to be the smaller operations. Given how much work is involved in sorting stuff out my hunch would be they simply don't have the staff to do all the leg-work in advance. As a much larger railway the WSR shouldn't really be in that position, but nonetheless I suspect that is the reason it's not reopening. A very small board feels like a contributory factor here.

 

If they were, people could drive there. WSR not running trains doesn't mean the SDRJT needs to be closed.

 

Yes I saw that. I wonder if the SVR's submission can be viewed? It might help a lot.

Steve

 

I have asked the WSR charities if they have applied. The Plc is not permitted to apply. The WSSRT is best placed I would have thought.

Steve

 

It looks like they are trying to do so. Give them a chance. VoR have said no running in 2020. Each railway is different. Patience.

 

I believe most WSR Plc staff are still furloughed (at least until very recently). Bit of a showstopper.

Steve

 

And having read the HLF webpage, I can easily imagine how the intent of the HLF grant could be met with some straightforward description of intents, and within the limits of charity rules. It comes back to applying will to find a way.

 

For most of the railways that have annoucned reopening plans or decisions to stay closed, there appears to be clear rationale for a choice that has been controlled by that railway's management. I don't see that clarity coming from Minehead, and the survey suggests that it has also not been extensively thought through. It is that that I find difficult to accept, rather than the conclusion.

 

I'll try Steve.

It look like there are two things in play. The NLHF does not appear to require that the recipient of a Covid -19 emergency grant is a Charity. Amongst other conditions the organisation must be "not for profit". Rather confusingly that doesn't mean it can't make a profit, just that any surplus must be re invested in the business and not distributed to shareholders. So if the NLHF is funding the SVR operating company directly it could spend the money on employment costs
( unless the grant imposes any restrictions).

The problem is where a Charity tries to use funds benefitting from tax concessions ( such as Gift Aid) to prop up losses in a commercial company. Apart from needing to disclose as part of fundraising who the recipient of funds will be, and the purpose for which they will be used, ( a requirement of the Fundraisng Code of Practice to which WSRA, for example, has signed up) the relevant Charity Commission guidance is as follows:

You and your co_trustees must:
not allow your charity's resources and activities to fund or support non-charitable purposes. For example, you must stay within your charitable purposes when working with a connected non -charity
carrying out joint projects,
giving funding,
receiving funding.

The intent is to ensure that charitable donations do not benefit a commercial company that would not be able to benefit from tax concessions in its own right unless they are furthering the objects of the charity. It's the same with charity shareholdings in a company. If that investment could help the company declare a dividend for its other non charitable shareholders then it is not a legitimate investment for the Charity to make. You'll no doubt notice that it's helpful that the PLC Articles do not allow it to declare a dividend for shareholders so the WSRA and WSSRT shareholdings are OK.

The restrictions apply to a connected non -charity body such as a trading subsidiary or non- charitable parent. It's even more of a constraint where such connection does not exist such as between the supporting charities and the PLC.

So if the NLHF grant was to the SVR Charity it would have to be careful to ensure it was only spent on the public benefit purposes of that Charity.

Clear as mud?

 

Agree, a very poor survey compared to other lines. How far you will travel to get there, and where you will travel from are surely really the same question.

 

For some railways, most maybe, but not all. The railway's management are clearly trying to gauge what the publics wants and needs are with the survey. Plenty on here are just giving a hard time for the sake of it.