Steam Dreams 2020

Not quite Neil,

If you look at the timings the White Cliffs run is due back in about 1530 with the evening run not leaving until 1815.

Andrew

 

True, but what would cover the Santa trips to North Pole Jn?

Cheers, Neil

 

Not running on the 18th

 

Apologies - skim reading when trying to hold a conversation!

Cheers, Neil

 

Just wondering if there's a reasonable round trip from Victoria that takes in North Pole Junction, perhaps allowing the train to reverse quite close to Victoria, so steam leads for 80-90% of each trip and a DL on the back just takes the train the last few miles (and assists departing Victoria as required). How about Victoria - Wandsworth Town - Hounslow - Richmond - Willesden J - North Pole J - Kensington Olympia - Clapham J (reverse) - Victoria? Can passenger trains get from the "N&SW Junction" line to the "West London Joint" line at Willesden J? My ancient Ian Allen Sectional Map Of Britain's Railways (as at January 1982) suggests a crucial link may be freight only...

 

Alternatively, think one could go out via Olympia, Acton Wells, Old Kew Jc, Chertsey, the rare third side of the triangle at Weybridge and back. The problem would be pathing on the SWML to Clapham, as most trips tend to go round the houses to avoid that section these days. Alternatively, use the freight only curve at Kew East Jc and head back.

 

The connection at Willesden is no problem, but I don't think your connection at Richmond exists. The best I can come up with while keeping clear of the SWML is Victoria - Wandsworth Town - New Kew Jn - Acton Wells Jn - Mitre Bridge Jn - North Pole (shunt into the Reversing Siding, thank you Romsey) - then as your route Clapham J (reverse) - Victoria. That provides the longer journey before your reach North Pole, then a shorter journey back to Victoria, which seems to me the right way round.

Edit: Instead of New Kew Jn - Acton Wells Jn, extend via Richmond - Hounslow - Brentford.

 

Is it not possible to get to the North London Line from the Staines line at Richmond? That's surprising, but it's many years since I travelled around that district by train.

I wasn't sure which way to go between Barnes and Acton Central: a figure-8 trip via Chiswick, Hounslow, Richmond and Kew Gardens appeals to me, with 3 river crossings. It also means you don't have to cross the other direction lines at Hounslow triangle, which might make it easier to path. Besides, I wasn't sure whether a passenger train can get from Brentford to Acton South, but if it's possible, as @Bulleid Pacific suggests, then turning left at Barnes (then Richmond, Hounslow, Kew East) is an alternative. I'm not sure I'd bother to stop and reverse into the siding at North Pole J, though.

(I do like a bit of Fantasy Railtour Planning...)

 

Try starting / finishing at Kensington Olympia via North Pole, Willesden South West Sidings, Acton Wells, Kew East, Barnes, Clapham Jn.

There were some trips with one of the standard tanks post Christmas in (I think) 1994 but the West London line is far busier these days and I doubt whether there would be enough platform time available at Kensington now.

 

I think that was 80079 and 46521. Ahh the days when an Ivatt 2 could go mainline!

 

A few points for the guestimation planning of the Steam Dreams Santa trips.

The connection from the Up Main Loop to the Windsor lines/ WLL at Clapham Jn is not cleared for passenger use.
I know of only one occasion it was used and that was due to multiple points failures around Staines/Feltham area. Also Clapham Yard is the property of South Western Railway and they need to give agreement for any non SWR movements to pass across the "Long Crossover".

Why do you need to reverse at Clapham Jn to get from Kensington Olympia to Victoria? There is a fully signalled route Latchmere Jn - Longhedge Jn - Stewarts Lane Jn - Victoria.

Somewhere a long way up thread there was a query about Willesden South West Sidings being Freight only. They were uprated to full passenger standards around the mid 1980's as part of the resignalling and upgrading of the West London Line. If you remember the Brighton - Manchester cross country services, they used Willesden SWS between the West London Line and the GW main line.

Mornington Crescent as a destination - superb!

Cheers, Neil

PS No one has yet mentioned "The Three Hills", much beloved of South Eastern Controllers turning defective stock before despatching it back to Ramsgate or Chart Leacon. Streatham Hill - Tulse Hill - Herne Hill was preferred as there were fewer conflicting movements to check.

 

Thanks Neil - the reason for reversing somewhere is so that steam leads out of Victoria on each of the 3 trips, and the reason for suggesting Clapham J is that it keeps the section where diesel is leading to the minimum. I'm assuming that the trains will start and end at Victoria, with steam at one end, diesel at the other. Of course, if SD/WCRC could put a steam loco on each end, or if they were going round a circuit rather than out-and-back, there'd be no need to reverse.

How would you squeeze 3 Santa trips a day to "North Pole" into the busy Southern suburbs, and still have time for an evening Surrey Hills diner?

 

Does the itinerary specifically state North Pole Junction? Vintage Trains claimed Tyseley through siding was the North Pole

 

Any railtour promoter could run a Santa train to anywhere and call it the North Pole. It just seems poetically right to make the real North Pole Junction the destination if the tour is in the London area and can get there. From that premise we're having fun working out possible routes. Steam railtours can and do start from many of the London termini and a few other London stations such as Ealing Broadway, but there seem to be almost as many from Victoria as all the others put together.

 

Yes, I see your point about reversing the train.
Reversing on the Chatham Reversible at Wandsworth Road/ Voltaire Road Jn would be a better bet with fewer trains to fit around and you have more choices of reaching low numbered platforms at Victoria.
There is also the question of somewhere for a water stop as most routes suggested have frequent services.

Cheers, Neil

 

Steam Dreams have removed the reference to the North Pole on the description of the Santa trips. It now reads:

 

So some Santa trains have run to pretend North Poles, but one that could perhaps have gone to a real North Pole (Jn) won't do either. Never mind, we had a bit of fun thinking what would be possible.

 

Ive noticed looking on steam dreams with 61306 outward (steam 1 way diesel ret) tour from London kings X to York tour on the 6 December has been removed from their 2020 tours page and been advertised as cancelled on railtours mainline info either cos of engineering works on the 3rd bore of gasworks tunnel or due to lack of bookings, at a guess.
Davo 56F