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GWSR General Discussion and Operations

Rasprava u 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' pokrenuta od michaelh, 25. Kolovoz 2013..

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  1. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Ah thanks Pete, you learn something new every day :)
     
    flying scotsman123, 6. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1101
    Pete Thornhill se sviđa ovo.
  2. Breva

    Breva Well-Known Member

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    It's not an earthen embankment, but a brick built one:
    12-04-27 016.jpg

    This marches through the northern suburbs for quite a stretch.

    12-04-27 019.jpg

    I would question the stability of these long brick walls now, they might need tie rods all the way along.

    Re the EA suggestion, there are no patches of trackbed to buy. The southern bit is owned by the council and is now a cycle track, with various bridges made unusable. There is no suggestion at all from the owner that we might be able to use it one day.

    The northern (Honeybourne ) end is owned by Railway Paths Ltd, and that is one integral 4 1/2 mile stretch, unencumbered by development or bridge removal, but with the liability of 7 old, unmaintained bridges.

    If you want to make a comparison with something, I'd suggest the Rother Valley connection structure. A special company was set up, at arms length from the KESR. That vehicle takes all the risks and finds the finance. If it loses, never mind, the KESR is unaffected. If it succeeds, everyone's a winner.
     
    Breva, 6. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1102
    toplight, Monkey Magic, MellishR i 3 ostalih se sviđa ovo.
  3. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    I agree, that brick embankment stretches across St Paul’s and right along past the lower High St.

    On your other point, had the SBR group achieved their aims, they would either built or been in the process of rebuilding the northern section, however that one faded away.
     
    Pete Thornhill, 6. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1103
  4. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    SBR group?
     
    MellishR, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1104
  5. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    flying scotsman123, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1105
    Pete Thornhill se sviđa ovo.
  6. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    Pete Thornhill, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1106
    flying scotsman123 se sviđa ovo.
  7. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

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    Also known as the Judean People's Front.
     
    Monkey Magic, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1107
    Gareth and Styx of Rock like this.
  8. Leafent

    Leafent New Member

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    Why didn't the GWSR buy the remaining mile or so of trackbed into Cheltenham Spa in the 1980's? Lack of Money?
     
    Leafent, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1108
    toplight se sviđa ovo.
  9. Vulcan Works

    Vulcan Works Member

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    With my construction hat on I’d say that all of it looks to be possible, the civil engineering is perfectly do-able. The bridges would be the most expensive items especially the Waitrose replacement bridge. The most significant factor in these sorts of projects is the attitude of stakeholders e.g. local authority, Ntwk Rail and property owners. If they all believe in a project then it is likely to succeed. If there is opposition or lukewarm support then it will be a struggle.

    As a rough ballpark I’d say £6m - £12m depending on how structurally sound the existing structures are. The Ntwk Rail connection could push this higher depending on what work is involved.
     
    Vulcan Works, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1109
  10. Breva

    Breva Well-Known Member

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    It was never on the table. What we managed to buy was the maximum that was available.
     
    Breva, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1110
    jnc, JBTEvans i ross se sviđa ovo.
  11. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    That's true at the Cheltenham end, but I thought we did originally try to buy up to Honeybourne but a local farmer objected, it was easier to scale back our purchase than to appeal the objection. All well before I was born of course so just what I have heard, could be wrong!
     
    flying scotsman123, 7. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1111
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  12. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    Cheltenham was a no go as the council wanted that bit. Early negotiations with BR had generated an offer to sell from the present GWSR boundary in Cheltenham to Honeybourne along with the Long Marston to Stratford section for £25,000.

    There was concerns that the PLC was at risk of taking on too much despite the successful negotiations, a reasonable price and a share issue which had raised three times the purchase price in a month.

    In light of these concerns, the PLC decided to scale back their purchase plans and purchase the section owned today. They paid £15,000 for it.
     
    Pete Thornhill, 8. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1112
    Monkey Magic, jnc, flying scotsman123 i 2 ostalih se sviđa ovo.
  13. Biermeister

    Biermeister Member

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    And now it has become an order of magnitude harder to reach Honeybourne. As I said in an earlier post carpe diem, i.e. go for what you might want in future now, whilst you can...
     
    Biermeister, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1113
    Monkey Magic se sviđa ovo.
  14. Pete Thornhill

    Pete Thornhill Resident of Nat Pres Staff Member Administrator Moderator Friend

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    At the time it was a fledgling organisation which lacked the credibility it has today, (having talked the talk and then walked the walk that is no longer an issue). Maybe they should of bought the Honeybourne section, but if they had done the original deal, that would of left additional liabilities not only with that section as they would also own Stratford-Long Marston, which unless they had access to Long Marston to Honeybourne would have been a white elephant.

    Railway preservation has changed over the years, also gaining the aforementioned credibility.

    Many of the wider local community thought the GWSR project wouldn’t even get off the ground and those behind it crackpots for even attempting it, they had basically nothing even when they had bought the trackbed, the wider scene wasn’t as established and there wasn’t funding on the scale of today. With that in mind, I do think it was the right decision to limit the trackbed as it released funds to develop an operating railway.
     
    Pete Thornhill, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1114
    35B, jnc, The Dainton Banker i 4 ostalih se sviđa ovo.
  15. Biermeister

    Biermeister Member

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    Thanks Pete. I do understand how the GWSR has been re-created from next to nothing and a wonderful job it is making of what it has. Crises are regularly overcome and the route is repaired, hopefully with an enhanced resilience. The GWSR is one of the jewels in today's GWR scene. (Although I do wish the blood and custard livery could be consigned to history but 'tis but a small matter!)

    Nevertheless, if there is an opportunity to safeguard the route north to Honeybourne now then it should be taken regardless of whether it might be used within the next five to ten years or not. The chance to do so might otherwise be permanently lost.
     
    Biermeister, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1115
    Monkey Magic, ross, jnc i 1 drugoj osobi se sviđa ovo.
  16. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    I believe that the G&WSR should stay with what they have i.e, success. A line too long could end up like the WSR - unprofitable. There will a few unwanted surprises probably plus projects still to achieve.
     
    Greenway, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1116
    Bluenosejohn and flying scotsman123 like this.
  17. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Agreed, I could quite happily think of ways to spend the money it would take to get to Honeybourne several times over, and at the end of it we'd be left with an improved railway rather than one that is too long.
     
    flying scotsman123, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1117
    burnettsj and Bluenosejohn like this.
  18. Biermeister

    Biermeister Member

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    Recent posters are completely missing my point: deliberately or otherwise...
    For the umpteenth time, what I am talking about is PROTECTING THE ROUTE! Any extension north might be ten years away or longer, but action now at least safeguards that opportunity. Sitting on one's hands and saying that we are good at what we do might not actually be what you want in ten years time... Some future vision is required.
     
    Biermeister, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1118
    toplight, MellishR, Monkey Magic i 2 ostalih se sviđa ovo.
  19. flying scotsman123

    flying scotsman123 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Curious, it's our most requested livery to do!

    Completely agree, important to protect the route. I'm just not sure whether is owning it along with all the liabilities is the best way forward.
     
    flying scotsman123, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1119
    burnettsj, jnc, Kje7812 i 1 drugoj osobi se sviđa ovo.
  20. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

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    If the State reckons the Honeybourne section important they would have/will open it.
     
    Greenway, 9. Kolovoz 2021.
    #1120
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