Locomotive Performance & Timing

That's what I was thinking, but wasn't certain. Thanks!

 

Or maybe even Kgf or Newtons

 

Yes, read a report like that on here the other day. Was hard going and the phrase “delusions of accuracy” sprang to mind.


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The risks of spreadsheets, and the spurious accuracy they engender.


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Not a new problem of course: think CoT and Rous-Marten.

 

Not really, engines are designed to be fired by one man. The maximum sustainable output of the fireman is how the engine should be worked. That then raises other questions about 'Blue Riband' validity. If the engine is coming off at Hellifield then Ais Gill is very different to an engine and fireman coming off at Crewe or York for example.

You can play of course to see what they can do but its not a true test of man, machine and environment.

 

It is easy to forget that back in the early '80 the BR Chief Medical Officer (no doubt with union support) had decreed that a fireman should be replaced after no more than 80 miles. This was because after a decade of working on diesels the pool of experienced volunteer firemen were likely to be less fit than they were to say nothing of being older. For a while they could only do York - Scarborough one way as a return was 84 miles. I cannot now remember when this ruling was relaxed.

Peter

 

We change around sometimes. Some of our young lads like to fire complete turns to prove they can do it.

On the above point, i was firing the Brit on 'that' run South over Ais Gill. It was great but there is no way i would have made Crewe and was glad of a rest from Hellifield. So in my view the performance is a bit of a fake. I'm not saying it wasn't fun, just not that real.

Maximum sustainable output of the engine/man is an ever moving goalpost. To see a fireman and engine working in the 'sweet spot' to use human aerobic performance terminology is a great thing to witness.

I've listened to the majority of Peter Handfords recordings from all regions and you rarely hear an engine being worked extremely hard which concurs with i think Peters comments on this subject in the thread.

 

It's interesting to think of BR days of the early 1960s when Crewe supplied firemen who were expected to work trains to Euston or - the classic case - the Crewe - Perth leg of a Euston - Crewe service or the classic Saltley - Carlisle 9F turn. I once travelled with a Camden firemen who described one Crewe - Euston run where they left the footplate at Euston (for the disposal crew) then went to the "local"; he claimed that he couldn't / didn't taste the first three pints as he had sweated so much on the footplate.

 

Reading Pete Johnson's books with the descriptions of firing on the Crewe to Perth and Crewe to Glasgow lodging turns, I can really tune in with what you say Mike.

It seems to me that you can do something very simple like measure the times between A and B with a 12 plus coach train and a standing start from A. That tells you purely and simply what went up there fastest. Or you start controlling for all sorts of things--- firing, wind and rain, whether the line speed was exceeded, tsrs. Then you are looking for the most meritorious run, but you are in the realm of the hypothetical. On my sums, with no tsr at Griseburn, Tornado would have been very close to the record that day, but would the fireman have been able to maintain the firing rate to permit 55 mph plus throughout the climb? We will never know.

A few years ago, I was thinking we would never see sub 20 minutes again with years of tsrs at Waitby, Griseburn etc attending to the cuttings and in some years a shortage of class 7/8 power. So, great, well done to all concerned.

 

Where are these laws?

 

Industry practice mainly based around Hidden following Clapham.

I believe the fireman on Tornado did it all on his own from what i've heard. Amazing performance i have to say if true. Chapeau!!

 

Aren't rules about rest periods and the like intended to protect the passengers at least as much as the staff?