Latest pre grouping liveries

I was idly musing about whether any pre-grouping liveries lasted long enough to be photographed in colour*.
Does anyone know what was the latest surviving pre-grouping livery, and on what locomotive?
I'm talking genuine pre-grouping, not locos repainted into big four then back into pre-grouping for preservation.

*I can think of at least one example but it's a bit of a cheat.

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Columbine was withdrawn in 1902 and, IIRC, was still in its 'as withdrawn' paintwork until after it was moved from the old York museum c.1975 so I it must have been photographed in colour.
Ray.

 

Photos of it in the 1960s seem to show a livery with red and white lining, whereas older photos show only red lining. So it may have been repainted?
Or is this just showing a thorough cleaning?!?!

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Columbine was one of my guesses.
My "cheat" answer is the Dundalk, Newry & Greenore locos, which remained in LNWR livery until closure in 1951 (as did the carriages - one of which is preserved at Cultra, in LNWR carriage livery).

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What about GNR Stirling No1? She was withdrawn in 1907....and carried on in the care of Doncaster works. She was used for some publicity runs, films and photos in the 1930's, but still in the care of the GNR's works where she was built. Anyone know when her last major service and paint job was?

 

AFAIK, the last surviving pre-grouping livery on the SR was Terrier "Waddon", which lasted until 1930 as SE&CR No. 751 - though that would have been in wartime grey, so hardly the peak of pre-grouping splendour!

Tom

 

The GWR livery didn't change greatly from 1906 to 1934, so presumably when 3440/3717 went to the LNER museum in 1931 she was to all intents and purposes in a late pre group livery, and retained that until repainted to a pre 1906 livery by BR in the 1950s. Not sure that's quite in the spirit of what you are asking though!

 

The first commercially available colour system was Autochrome Lumière, which came on the market in 1907, so the potential is there... However the only Autochrome photo I know of featuring a British railway subject, is a photo of a GWR halt taken in 1920.

Regarding colour photos of a pre-grouping train, the only one I know of is this one of a L&Y railmotor, taken in, I think, 1919. (You'll need to scroll down a little.) My memory is a bit hazy on the details, but if I'm not mistaken this used a different, two-colour process hence the heavy yellow/brown tint.

 

That's exactly along the lines I was thinking!

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Yes that L&Y railmotor photo is amazing!

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According to RCTS, Stratford Works continued for some time after Grouping to paint engines in GER austerity grey livery, but with LNER numbering. The last to run in this style was stated as F4 No 7099, withdrawn in 1932.

There were of course various hybrid liveries in the early Grouping period. I read somewhere that Darlington continued to use up its stocks of NER Saxony Green, which was very close to GNR/LNER Apple Green.

Given that Crewe Works was notoriously slow to repaint into LMS livery, it would be interesting to know how long "full LNWR" livery survived on the LMS.

 

One of the LNWR 0-6-0 saddle tanks was works shunter at Crewe and it kept its LNWR number, 3323, and it was never renumbered by either the LMS or BR.

I don't think this would be a priority case for repainting

 

Though that brings up another point - was City of Truro the last engine to sport pre-grouping livery while working regular scheduled trains?

 

For a colour photo, there’s this from 1960:


The wagon (and probably the one adjacent) was ordered 1914 - built 1915, in which it would have been in standard LBSC pale grey with white lettering. Repainted into SR livery 1928. Grounded 1942 at Redhill, probably as a store for the wartime control centre there. In the intervening period, all traces of the 1928 SR livery have disappeared to reveal the LBSC livery.

Tom

 

Definitions. Locomotives work scheduled trains in pre grouping livery regularly on heritage lines to this day. Although 3440 was working some regular scheduled trains alongside specials, there's still an argument to say that was really an early example of heritage rail services: she had, after all, been repainted in the pre 1906 livery as a historical artifact, it wasn't as if she had retained that livery through her museum days. And British Railways had other locomotives in "heritage" liveries in the late 50s, although I'm not sure to what extent they worked scheduled trains. At least one worked as a station pilot though IIRC.

 

North Staffordshire Railway 0-6-2T No 2 now at Foxfield was sold from LMS service in 1937 to Manchester Colleries. In 1960 as part of the celebrations for the Jubilee of Stoke on Trent she was restored at Crewe works to full North Staffordshire Livery ( as an example of how seriously Crewe took the restoration the whistle then on the loco was exchanged for a genuine NSR one ).

After the celebrations had ended the engine resumed its colliery works in pre grouping livery until withdrawal and subsequent preservation.

https://preservedrailway.weebly.com/north-staffordshire-railway.html

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/2-0-6-2t-north-staffordshire-railway-l-class/

 

Is its current paint job still that 1960 one out of interest, or has it been redone since?

 

I wondered that but could find no reference to a repaint since.

 

It was less to do with bloody mindedness at Crewe than the major reorganisation of the works which was carried out between 1925 and 1927. The paint shop's capacity was reduced during this period. From February 1928 the number of all classes on the LMS that were to be painted red was reduced largely because of cost.

Thanks to Robert Riddles efforts all the locomotives that carried British Railways lined black can be said to have been carrying LNWR livery!

 

Just curious because some bits look a little rough, and some of the lining is distinctly wibbly wobby!