Jacobite 2023

Question?

If WCRC had a problem with stewarding the Jacobite might it have been possible following the first ORR inspection to have rustled up some stewards at short notice from the heritage community to cover until local employees could be recruited?

Worth a try at least

 

Seems very quiet in the "Like" District at the moment. Even the windmill is silent?

 

It's 10% above the 'living wage' recommendation of £10.90 which is generally seen as a fair deal by employers, I don't think many companies offer £12 an hour to wait tables etc, I don't believe supermarkets offer that much, but as you say it is a remote location.

 

We are all humans.

 

I'm not suggesting a few weeks, even a few days would help.

If nothing else from a WCRC perspective it would show that something had been done

 

I can quite understand why WCRC will make no public comment, particularly on here where it would almost certainly provoke even more uninformed comment. On the subject of recruiting stewards from heritage railways, apart from the distance involved there would be a problem of accommodation in Fort William in high season, it’s either non existent or costly. I recently had the chance of going up there at no travel cost which is why I asked if anyone knew what the problem was early in this thread. The nearest I could get on Air B&B was at Kinlochleven, over 20 miles away or £140 a night in the Travelodge, all other booking sites came up with nothing.
There are two parties to the current difficulties, they are clearly intent on solving the issues and should be left to get on with it, uninformed comment and hindsight criticism achieves nothing. WCRC are the major player in allowing us to enjoy our hobby at no cost to ourselves. Whatever the current problems are it should be remembered that they have operated the Jacobite safely and given great memories to a vast number of passengers for over thirty years. Unfortunately we have a regime where, not just in railway operation, regulators have virtually unlimited power with no responsibility. The ORR will carry on regulating the industry, it keeps them in a job and ( this is only a personal view) I can see the day coming when they ban heritage stock from the network. Enjoy it while you can.

 

When was the last time you were in Germany ?.That may have been so 20 years ago at Plandamps ,but Germans are certainly not allowed to clamber over tracks now. There are far more railway police in Germany than here ,and they normally have a number of officers present on platforms .Where have you seen open cars in Australia on main line tours.? Regards America I assume you mean the USA ,they are safety mad there. Even 30years ago I had a rollicking for trying to get on a train before it had come to a complete stand still, about a yard before it finally stopped.

 

Aldi I believe the highest paying of the big Supermarkets at £11.4o an hour with Asda at £11.11. Tesco and Sainsbury slightly less.
But of course if you look at some other forums any railway role is so safety critical then no surprise that the pay is higher.

 

I too am of the opinion of ORR will probably end up banning heritage stock before long, effectively they have banned the Jacobite running the past month, think how quickly we have gone from being able to put heads out of Mk3s at 125mph to having to have stewards on the leisurely Jacobite. Less than 5 years, with a pandemic in-between. We are probably one accident away from that judging by the reaction to the deaths in the mid 2010s from droplights.

 

I don't think this stewarding job is safety critical though. It's just marshalling the doors to stop people putting their heads out. TfW had similar on the Mk2 37s up the Rhymney valley line in 2019/20. They weren't safety critical as far as I know, just bods to stand there. On occassions the trains ran without them.

Are the RTC etc stewards deemed safety critical does anybody know?

 

Can we please get away from this idea that the ORR are being heavy handed, over reacting, acting out of spite, trying to ban anything heritage.. Whatever else has been suggested above. They are simply doing their job!!
The ORR acted because the TOC was not instigating the procedures the TOC themselves had put forward to mitigate a defined risk. In any other industry, if I wasn't doing what I was supposed to be be doing, I would expect to be pulled up. If the job was in a high risk industry that is very likely to be the appropriate regulator.
These aren't suggestions from the ORR, they are not telling West Coast what to do - they are highlighting that the operator has not done what it said it would it would be doing to limit risk to the public.
Sticking heads out of windows & manual doors are all risks that have come to prominence because of several severe incidents and numerous near misses - this is also becoming apparent on heritage railways too. This isn't a flash in the pan whim to ban heritage stock or spoil people's enjoyment, but is based on evidence. Evidence that people are no longer familiar with heritage stock.
Just because something was acceptable 10 years ago, doesn't mean it's OK now. The modern railway is not static in time. The ORR's job is accident prevention and keeping the public safe, that isn't incompatible with heritage stock, but it is more tricky as times and familiarity change. Hence having agreed procedures in place to minimise risk and prevent accidents. If an accident does happen, the first question is always correctly 'how could it have been prevented'. An accident stopped is a life saved or someone not suffering life changing injuries.
Our railway has an enviable safety record in recent years, this hasn't happened by chance - the ORR should be congratulated, not seen as the enemy.
I would also take issue with the Jacobite being described as 'leisurely'. It operates up to 40mph, goes through many tight tunnels, has a lot of close vegetation and requires locos to work very hard. There are also short platforms - all pose a risk to someone poking their head out of a window or inadvertently opening a door.

 

Can I like this more than once?
I really don’t understand what some people don’t get that safety conditions regarding a licence to operate are mandatory, you can’t just pick and choose what suits you.
Let’s not forget this isn’t the first time the same operators had problems regarding Health and Safety with its operations is it?
Tampering with TPWS anyone?

 

I don't know, but this was posted on wnxx :

It is a safety critical function overseen by the guard who then supervises the stewarding arrangements but it should be noted that many of the stewards are not even railway employees on trains run by UKR, PF, Vintage, H&H (& others) merely `volunteers` and therefore not subject to the same rules as the guard. Secondary door locking was introduced as a `workaround` as mentioned upthread and the method of working designed around that. They do not have to be `certified` in any way but are subject to the drink/drugs protocols that apply and have to sign a document held by the guard that they understand their role. The rules around this are quite loose unfortunately and, on introduction, subject to many questions asked of the guards who have to take responsibility for persons not even employed by any railway company. However it does work and has allowed Mark I stock to continue in traffic far longer than envisaged.

 

BBC coverage of the return to 'normal' operations.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66441796

 

I wonder if 30 November is specific to the Jacobite or if it replaces 30 September for the whole WCR operation.

 

I agree with much of that, but take issue with the reference to vegetation. If that is a safety risk to someone with their head out of a window, then that is because it is not being managed appropriately.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk