If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Bluebell Railway Giants of Steam 17th-19th October 2025

Discussion in 'Galas and Events' started by Ben Jenden, Jan 31, 2025.

  1. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    28,407
    Likes Received:
    67,256
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It was certainly mentioned several times by the platform announcements. I'm sure many gala attendees would have studied the timetable, at which point it became obvious that all four locos ended up at Horsted Keynes simultaneously.

    Friday on Tornado, despite some issues on shed, we did our first two departures on time and the last ten minutes late due to an issue with the vac bags being stiff to join the two locos; that had some knock-on impact at the end of the day as we were still ten minutes late back to Horsted on the down train, but things had been on time until then. Had there not been an evening Arrow, we would probably have been five minutes down at the end of the day.

    Looking at the time stamp of my photo yesterday of Betton Grange leaving after the line up on Saturday afternoon, it was about two minutes late. I left after that so not sure how the day ended.

    I checked the web cams at various points on Sunday afternoon and things seemed to be on time or no more than a couple of minutes late. The Beachy Head / Tornado double header arrived at East Grinstead about 10 seconds early for the last train of the day.

    With regard late running: there is recovery time in the timetable, but it is odd minutes here and there, not a single big chunk of "in case things go wrong". For example, trains had 10 minutes to run Kingscote - EG, but generally you only need 7; that allowed some recovery of anything lost on the up journey. At Sheffield Park, there was normally ten minutes between a down train arriving and an up train departing, whereas you can do that in 5 on a normal day when no-one wants to move between trains. The extra time no doubt allowed for those rushing between trains. Squeezing that time down to five minutes would probably just have caused late running to allow for laggards to get across the footbridge.

    There is a lot of thought that goes into the operational notes that are distributed to loco crew, guards, signalmen and platform staff. As an example on Saturday, after the line up, Tornado departed south and on arrival at Sheffield Park ran round ready to form an up service. Beachy Head was the next south-bound departure and was due to double head the same service immediately after arrival. That wouldn't allow either time or platform occupancy to take water - so the notes included an instruction for Beachy Head to take water in the down yard at Horsted Keynes before departure; and upon arriving at Sheffield Park, uncouple at the inner home and run straight onto the front of Tornado ready for departure, with the station pilot loco drawing the train into the other platform at Sheffield Park. It worked because it had been thought through in advance; there is not much scope for improvisation. (I have visions of Graham and Chris having a big Brio train set in the office at Sheffield Park to check platform and siding occupancy during planning, but I think they are more experienced than that!)

    I'm always somewhat surprised how accepting many people are about gala timetables going completely awry. Clearly, a significant operational problem can happen to anyone, but if everything runs without exceptional circumstances (such as a loco, rolling stock or signalling issue, line side fire etc), it should also run to time as planned, IMHO - if it doesn't, your timetable was probably unrealistic in the first place.

    Tom
     
    jon5051, beavis, alts1985 and 5 others like this.
  2. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    30,387
    Likes Received:
    31,707
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I agree - but my experience is that quite often gala timetables go awry because there's insufficient "snap" from those on the ground, causing delays of a minute here, a minute there which then mount up.
     
    Robert Heath No.6 likes this.
  3. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    28,407
    Likes Received:
    67,256
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Which is a predictable scenario ;)

    At galas, particularly with “star” locos, it is common behaviour that people wish to rush between trains. So it becomes something you can allow for - hence the ten minute swaps at Sheffield Park between arrival on one platform and departure from another, when five minutes is all that is required for the token work.

    Tom
     
    WorkingPressure225 and 35B like this.
  4. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    30,387
    Likes Received:
    31,707
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    That too - though I was thinking from operating staff on the ground, not the public. It's sometimes been noticeable that there's been tolerance of the timetable drifting, with no sense of urgency about run rounds or getting a train despatched.
     
  5. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Resident of Nat Pres

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    Messages:
    8,835
    Likes Received:
    7,512
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Swanage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I would tend to agree, and this aspect I think has grown over the years, which of course could be down to things like ORR focus on all sorts of things these days, and an generally ageing volunteer corps.
    Reading @Jamessquared detailed review and limited webcam glances it did appear to be on time every time I looked, unlike say the WSR this weekend where the last two days I was struggling to even know what train was supposed to on the camera I was watching. Maybe the Bluebell was also helped by the fact that whilst having double the trains of a normal busy day, they were not "non standard" in their make up or hindered by the insertions of freights.
    Talking of cams after I realised I had missed the line up, at about 15;55 I glanced at SP where there were a fair few very bored and some quite angry looking folks with still a long wait for a train, so maybe they had not read the timetable too well either.:(
     
    green five likes this.
  6. John Petley

    John Petley Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,986
    Likes Received:
    2,612
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Researcher/writer and composer of classical music
    Location:
    Between LBSCR 221 and LBSCR 227
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I must say how much I enjoyed the gala on Saturday. Being someone who likes to take a few pictures as well as travelling, I don't normally bother visiting heritage railways if the sun doesn't shine, but it was worthwhile making an exception for this occasion, especially as it's only about 45 minutes' drive from my home to Sheffield Park.

    Beside the four operational new builds, there were stands publicising several other new-build projects, including the B17, Patriot and, of course the Bluebell's own 84030 project. I happen to know two of the volunteers manning this stand and was kindly given a tour of the loco, which looks as if it will be a most useful machine when completed. I also appreciated the chance to "cab" 2999 after the four-loco line-up at Horsted. I guess Bluebell crews must be pretty familiar with driving (G)WR 4-6-0s given 6989's long stay on the line, although I sincerely hope that the crew rostered to drive 2999 didn't get soaked on Sunday - that Churchward cab is very spartan and I didn't spot any storm sheet.

    Also appreciated the chance to chat with one of the 6880 team and to learn that a Grange isn't just a Hall with 5'8" wheels and a wiggly section of frame over the cylinders. Apparently, there are a lot of other differences and that below the frames, it's almost entirely a new loco except for the front bogie.

    In a funny sort of way, a trip behind Tornado from HK back to Sheffield Park, even though it hardly broke into a sweat, felt like it has finally laid to rest the ghost of the "Ebor Flyer" six years after my previous less-than-successful encounter with this engine.

    Another plus was the excellent chocolate ice cream I bought from the kiosk at Sheffield Park!

    I'm very pleased for the railway that, judging by the numbers of people in attandance, the decision to bring in no fewer than three visitors seems to have paid off.....

    ... and finally, it was the least delayed gala I have attended this year!
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2025 at 4:51 PM
  7. acorb

    acorb Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    3,174
    Likes Received:
    4,981
    Location:
    Powys
    Good to see 6880 winning some more fans, it stole the show for me when it visited the SVR earlier this year. After a particularly vigorous departure from Northwood Lane, the driver was heard to comment on arrival at Bewdley that it 'steamed like a witch', 'went like stink' and was possibly 'one of the strongest locos he had ever driven'. Fine praise indeed given the traction the SVR has hosted over the years and just reward for those who have built it!
    2999 was also very enjoyable on the valley when it had an extended stay a few years back. Bridgnorth did some work on the front end, cured a few niggles and it turned into a very elegant and good performer - looking superb on the GWR stock.
    This looks to have been a very good event and a fine celebration of preservation's achievements in Rail 200 year.
     
    Mick45305, Dan Hill and green five like this.
  8. OldSchoolTrains2

    OldSchoolTrains2 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2020
    Messages:
    139
    Likes Received:
    201
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The West
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    To me this is one of the most impressive things about Bluebell galas and timetabling, and I've mentioned it a few times on here and enjoyed Jamessquared's thorough explanations of what goes into their timetable planning - yes, Giants is (relatively) simple as a timetable, but the Branch Line weekend and this August's Anniversary Gala were way more complex with lots of short journeys, loco swaps and creativity, and the timekeeping was immaculate. Whereas it does tend to quickly drift into lateness on many other lines even before anything goes wrong-wrong. So that proves that if you have the right infrastructure and planning, a complex gala timetable needn't equal late running.

    I ended up with much less of my weekend free than expected so had to cancel my plans for a big south-east mega-trip of Bluebell Giants, Romney Gala and Spa Beerfest (though I did manage a brilliant couple of hours closer to home at the Dean Forest's Class 50 and Tanker day at least). The bit of Giants I was really sad to miss was the 2999 + 6880 double-header, which I had a feeling would be sensational out of HK. The Manor + Hall double-header at last May's Branch Line weekend was up there in my top 5 preserved line runs of all-time I reckon - so my expectations for a pair of loud GWR locos up that hill were high. I think I might have to avoid watching any videos of Giants as I might end up a little too jealous of what I missed.
     
  9. alts1985

    alts1985 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes Received:
    787
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Store Manager for the Co-operative Group
    Location:
    Stevenage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    My video from the weekend, what a brilliant couple of days, I can't remember a 'Giants of Steam' that busy before! Arriving at Horsted Keynes behind 2999 ready for the line up the station and field was already very busy, we choose a spot towards the top of the field under the trees in the hope of getting a bit of space even though the view was further away, it paid off as although I could of got near the fence at the bottom when we arrived I wouldn't of wanted to be so crammed in such were the crowds. With everything being so busy filming was a challenge at times, one of those weekends where you need to include the crowds, hopefully done the show some justice and hopefully the weekend has been a success for everyone.

     
  10. Dan Hill

    Dan Hill Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,867
    Likes Received:
    1,009
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Brick Machine Operator
    Location:
    Haywards Heath
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I haven't uploaded to YouTube before and not sure if I'll post more on it just yet, as I don't really film anything to upload and usually just take videos on my phone, but I thought I'd upload my video of the Great Western double header to show how impressive the departure looked.

     
    alts1985 and WorkingPressure225 like this.
  11. WorkingPressure225

    WorkingPressure225 New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2023
    Messages:
    69
    Likes Received:
    87
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    75H / 71B
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    That service might actually be the best run I have ever had on the Bluebell! And it was Westerns :eek:

    This video from Chailey Stowe at around 39:45 shows how hard they were working towards the top of the summit - and that’s after they shut off a bit! I’m sure somebody will have footage from that service but I haven’t found any on YouTube yet.
     
    Dan Hill likes this.
  12. Phil K

    Phil K Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    618
    Likes Received:
    83
    Location:
    Ewell, Surrey
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I found Saturday to be an absolutely fantastic day - although it has to be said come mid morning I started to worry my anxiety would not cope with the crowds. Thankfully I rod it out and had a great day, and teh whole organisation was a true credit to teh Bluebell.

    COntarary to popular opinion, Dad and I had our best runs behind the Saint, but Betton Grange and Tornado were fantastic co-stars! Oddly for us, the busiest train we ended up on was one of the trains hailed by Beachy Head - still pulling in the crowds after her first year in traffic.
     
  13. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    28,407
    Likes Received:
    67,256
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    I ended up only rostered one day, so had a day for looking round as well.

    Friday I was rostered on Tornado, with book on only an hour before off shed and preparation handled by their support crew.

    IMG_4249.jpeg IMG_4247.jpeg

    For various reasons we were late off shed (15 minutes to spare rather than the booked one hour) so we literally hooked on, drew into the platform and went very quickly afterwards. Hence I didn't really have the fire right before starting: we got there OK, but it wasn't a great trip. The second one, with time to prepare properly, was much better, but I don't think I have ever shovelled so much. 50 sq ft is a big area to cover, and I couldn't help thinking that we could have done the same job with 80151 with a lot less effort! Come back Paul Hitch, all is forgiven ...

    For the last trip, we were diagrammed to couple to 32424 in the loco yard headshunt, which proved problematic as the "up to up" coupling and stiff vacuum bags proved recalcitrant. The third man fired that trip (with a degree of help); it was a lot of fun, and the acceleration from Horsted Keynes through Horsted House Farm until we slowed for the slack was superb - hardly surprising with a six coach train and essentially class 10+ motive power! Unfortunately (and this is where complexities in planning may not be immediately obvious) our ten minute delay starting meant the Saint (which we crossed at Kingscote) was ten minutes late arriving into HK, and then had a complex shunt of its set into Platform 1, which it was only just finishing as we ran back into HK just after 6pm - in fact we ran into platform 3 as it ran down through platform 2 at the end of its shunt. By then it should already have been heading south; the complexity of the moves at Sheffield Park meant it had to go first to prepare for the Evening Arrow, so our 2 minute booked stop became 20 to allow it to go through the section. It did give a nice opportunity to speak to some passengers though; through the day we must have had scores of people on the footplate. Thus we got back about 25 down, I think the only seriously late running through the weekend.

    Saturday I had a family commitment that meant I had to leave the railway by about 4pm at the latest, so I elected to start at Horsted Keynes, see the line up and then go. (I'd missed the cavalcade at the 65th anniversary event due to being in New Zealand, so didn't want to miss another). Time for a catch up with Chris Wilson in the Carriage Shop - a regular contributor to Bluebell Times - and then I caught 6880 with the 9:15 departure out of Platform 1 at Horsted Keynes, a significant event. Apart from our own efforts on Friday <blush/> I think 6880 going north was the best running for me that I was on, particularly the recovery from the p/way slack south of the tunnel. The service wasn't too busy, and I got a seat in a compartment in 3687, the newly-overhauled Hastings brake. At East Grinstead a few moments to have a chat with the BRPS Chairman.

    From there, I came back to Kingscote, a quick cross platform dash and caught 2999 back up to East Grinstead and then all the way back to Sheffield Park.

    IMG_4282.jpeg

    I had a quick look round Atlantic House, and was able to pick up a complete set of E.L. Ahrons "Locomotive and Train Working in the latter half of the 19th century" for a song. Main news from Atlantic House is two fold: firstly that dismantling the B4 is complete, and the project is now at the refurbishment of removed components stage prior to reassembly. Secondly, the decision has been taken on the 0415 to construct an entirely new boiler.

    I returned to 2999 for the 12:45 departure, which neatly got me to Horsted Keynes in time for the Carriage Shed Tour starting at 1:05pm (see - the advantages of running to time means you can offer timings in advance on other tours! ;) ) hosted by @David R. "Betty" - the LBSCR all third - has progressed to having glass fitted in some compartments. Next to that were the two petrol tankers subject to a rapid overhaul for a film contract. On the next road, 7864 - the Maunsell Restaurant Car - was present just by a pile of wood and one section of framing, but the significance is that that section is the last to be repaired. So this is another project that has essentially gone past the dismantling stage and is now on the verge of "mantling". The under frame - newly painted - was on the maintenance road on accommodation bogies, and is considered to be in very good condition given how long it was stored in the open. Also in the maintenance road is 949, the Brighton brake 3rd, up on jacks and still needing work on the underframe. The Mets, 4 wheelers, LSWR brake etc were all under cover in storage, not being needed for the event.

    IMG_4288.jpeg IMG_4287.jpeg IMG_4286.jpeg IMG_4285.jpeg

    The tour finished such there was time to catch Tornado on the 1:47 departure to East Grinstead and back, arriving at 3:00. By that time the field was already completely rammed, but I found a spot near the south end and had a chat to David Jones (of Atlantic, Maunsell, Pullman fame ...) while Tornado ran round and then Betton Grange arrived to complete the set. Photo duly taken, it was a slow file back across the foot crossing and then a rather brisker walk to my car. Thankfully the M25 played ball going home and as a bonus for once I got home in the light!

    Tom
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2025 at 9:59 PM
  14. A1X

    A1X Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Messages:
    1,253
    Likes Received:
    1,336
    Occupation:
    Insurance
    Location:
    Good Old Sussex by the Sea
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
  15. alts1985

    alts1985 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes Received:
    787
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Store Manager for the Co-operative Group
    Location:
    Stevenage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer

Share This Page