Weymouth Seaside and Torbay express 2011

Bristol Temple Meads will be the place to be on sundays from mid july when the RTC's Weymouth Seaside express goes up against the Torbay express. The published times have both trains leaving at exactlky the same time - 09.15! You might have to make your choice! Will be interesting to see how loadings go with both trains running on the same day, I have heard mutterings that the Torbay has been steadily getting more expensive each year and has now run for a few years. With 4936, 5029, 70000 for the weymouths and 6024, 71000 and 60163 for the Torbays (provisional) means that there may be upto 6 locos shedded at Bristol (albeit Barton Hill/SPM) at the same time! now where is that 83A St Phillips Marsh shed plate. . .

 

82B Surely?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_Railways_shed_codes#Western_Region

 

I guess that depends on the date you're modelling. Shed codes changed every so often...

 

I don't think SPM did, says 1950-1964 when I presume it closed.

 

Personally, as a mainline steam fan, I think it's a great shame for one operator, in this case RTC, to try to kill off another.

There is a limited Bristol Sunday steam train tourist market. Are RTC doing anything to expand it? I don't think so. Suppose they succeed, with their deep pockets, in killing TE, and then there's just their trains left. They will have made a brilliant TE experience (high quality trains, Dawlish sea wall, Paignton-Dartmouth, etc) unviable. Who gains from that other than the RTC owners? I suspect we'd find next year alternating RTC services, one Sunday to Weymouth, next the "RTC Torbay Express", but now without the TE quality. Great.

If RTC feel there's a huge untapped Bristol-Weymouth market, why not try it on Saturdays, or Thursdays?

Trainspotters at Bristol may feel they're gaining this year, but I think it's a sad episode for the development of a thriving mainline steam market.

Steam Dreams are doing the right thing in trying to open up new non-London-based markets, in my opinion. RTC are acting like sharks in the case of Bristol Sunday trains.

 

83A being Newton Abbott according to my list.

 

Steve

After taking over from Past Time, Torbay Express increased the standard fares from £ 55.00 to £ 75.00 in less than a year for a repeat intinery tour. They reduced the reduction for Children ( they are now offering an increased reduction) and were uncompetitive compared to RTC & Steam Dreams. Torbay Express decided to offer dining, which is being increased this year, and went away from the Family market. The Torbay Express I was on in June last year had less than 300 people on it. RTC'S Weymouth trips are more for the Family market, and do not offer dining. The cost for a family of four on the RTC Weymouth trip is £ 140.00 while it is £ 248.00 for the Torbay Express( I think it was £ 280.00 last year). Torbay Express have decided to target the dining market, and the price increases were too steep for familys. There was a post on Nat Pres last year from someone who worked with people who were not enthusiasts, and they though the prices were on the high side before the increases. Torbay Express have priced themselves out of part of the market, and RTC are filling the gap.

The Torbay Express trips have become too expensive for Familys

Paul

 

Of course I should have said 82b! Kinlet is coming out in Br green ( I did ask for black!) and I hoped it might have an 83a plate having been shredded there in the early 50's.

 

As a regular traveller on the TE in all but the very first year it is with great sadness that I have to agree with Paul42. Every trip I have done has been with my family (two sons and sometime mum and grandparents as well) and the TE is the very best trip possible for enthusiasts and families alike, something for everybody, sensible timings, really the best. The atmosphere on the trains has always been great with everybody in the seaside mood and many families, truly a different experience from any other trip I’ve travelled on.

That ‘buzz’ was already changing last year and I understand further changes will happen this year. I wish TEX Ltd. every success but I really think it’s unfair to criticise RTC for offering the public the option of what used to be a very successful format in the Past-Time era.

 

Based on comments posted last year, (and based on some basic maths), with 9 coaches (3 first, buffet+4 standard, 1 POB) I think that's a total of roughly 426 seats. The maximum total revenue would be around £24k and that's assuming all adults (no familys). Once you factor those in, the revenue total comes down. Based on a totally sold out train, there doesn't appear to be much profit margin. Would a hall go with the same load as a castle too.? I know trips aren't cheap to go on but they aren't cheap to run either.

 

Thats quite right and with the weymouth trip its a lot less miles as well and no way such a good run as with the torbays you get the fab sea wall some fast running and good inclines if fact a great day out;and great crew's ;

all the best
jane

 

The manager of Torbay express is quoted in the latest SR that they are targeting a 'quality product at a mature customer' with an increase in dining on their trains. It would appear they are no longer interested in the family market and are targeting the more well healed traveller. I would suggest that the families Torbay Express are excluding with their fare increases will gladly travel on RTC's trains, as will I! Repeat trips are also cheaper to run and 2 trains were run last year which has obviously convinced RTC that there is a viable market. I think the two trains will complement rather than compete and Bristol on a Sunday offers easy accesibility from around the country as well as good, free, on street parking.

 

I'm glad it wasn't. <BJ>

 

There will be no former Past-Time stewards on the Torbays this year. A couple have moved away, but the general consensus is that the tours bear little resemblence to what they were when they started a few years ago, and are now just seen as a cash cow with the stewards being taken for mugs and totally unappreciated. It's no fun getting up at 5.30am, driving 150 miles to Bristol, doing the tour, then driving home again, not getting in til midnight, and what makes it worse is there was never so much as a thank you from TEL at the end of it.

 

I was on both the trips to weymouth with 5029 last year, the castle may have been down to a slog on evershot both times, but i,m sure a hall would take the same load at the pace up evershot.

 

That is a shame to hear. It was always good to be greeted by familiar, friendly faces, year on year. For the record I thought you did a good job and I am sure many others would agree.

 

Just found this on the Torbay Express web site added yesterday !
http://www.torbayexpress.co.uk/index.php/TourDetailsBathSpa.html

 

Rather an old photo of 4498. One would think they could have got a more up to date shot.

 

I don't think RTC are trying to "kill off" the Torbay Express at all.

All RTC are doing is filling in a gap in the market which was lost when Past Time Rail went bust. The TE offers a dining train to a pleasant coastal resort (you could argue that thier market is usually older people), whereas the Weymouth train offers families a day out to the beach with a bit of difference. Having travelled on both trains last year I did notice that there were a lot more younger people on the Weymouth trains than on the TE... The different audiences were quite obvious.

If RTC weren't making a profit from these trains then why would they plan more for this year?

Taken from the GWR Service Timetable Appendices 1945:

Yeovil to Evershot (through loads): Castle - 315, Hall - 288

I believe 5029 took slightly more than this load last year. I have no doubt 4936 can take the same amount as the Castle... They accelerate a lot quicker and really do dig into climbs so should be ok!

 

A Hall is only a Class 5 though, whilst a Castle is a Class 7. I'd be sceptical that 4936 could take 9 alone as 5029 did. She maybe a good climber but even 44932 and 30777 had bankers out of Weymouth last year.