VT Shap, S&C Double-Header with 5043 and 6201 - March 10th 2012

We are still planning on using the same two engines - couldn't resist - Sorry!

We have a few seats left, but not many!

 

Good Question! I will find out.

 

6201 double headed with 76079 on a cotton mill a few years back,
6201 was going LE from Carnforth to Bury,
76079 was diverted via Helifield, Carnforth to Preston, they met at Preston and double headed to Manchester.

Somewhere here there pictures..

A quick google I found this..

http://www.locoscene.co.uk/viewforummessage.php?id=33349
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iwl7P_8mHnc

15th March, 2008 apparently

 

It was on 15 March 2008 that 6201 & 76079 double headed “The Cotton Mill” from Preston to Manchester Vic. The Cotton Mill hauled by 76079 had been diverted to run via Bolton, Blackburn, Hellifield and Carnforth because of a line closure at Elland. If I recall correctly there had been an embankment slippage that covered the track. 6201 was put on the front as pilot engine at Preston. I don’t think there has been an occasion where 6201 has been piloted, at least in preservation. Now there's a thought for next year!

 

Note this train runs on the same day as 70000 running south over the S&C. I guess they should run reasonably close one behind the other.

 

I have read that when double-heading it was forbidden to have a 'Duchess' as pilot to a smaller loco. Did this rule apply to the
'Princess Royals' also?

 

Some rough times for Sat 10 March

70000
Carlisle d 13:20
Hellifield d 16:03
Farington Jc 18:04
Crewe a 19:02

5043+46201
Carnforth d10:22
Carlisle a 11:43
Carlisle d 14:42
Hellifield 17:11/17:56
Farington Jc 19:01
Crewe a 20:10

 

IIRC it was actually piloted by 35028 returning from Shildon after S&D 150 in September 1975, all the way from Shildon to Gloucester.

It was not unusual to see things like Black 5's and 5X's piloting pacifics in steam days but the use of two pacifics double heading was expressly prohibited, although it would be a brave man who said it never happened, particularly during the dark days - and nights! - of world war 2. There are even noted occasions of some of Crewe Norths small allocation of 2p's piloting Coronations.

Regards
Bob

 

Thanks for that info Bob, just shows you cannot have your eyes and ears everywhere. Maybe there will be an opporunity to swap the locos round at Carlisle ie. whatever is pilot over Shap becomes train engine over the S&C

 

Both the Great Western and North Eastern used to put the pilot engine behind the train engine. Bit odd seeing 6024 coming off and 7325 being put inside at Newton Abbot a few years ago.

Though as this tour doesn't go on either GW or NE regions, which loco will be deemed superior and haul the train, while the other is relegated to piloting?

 

I wouldn’t dare say one of these two is superior to the other. All I know is the railway has (had!) rules about such things that dictates which one will be leading.

“Relegated” to piloting? Someone has a death-wish! lol

 

Lizzie in the Lead over Shap(LMS mainline), Mount Edgecumbe over the Settle and Carlisle. That would be the ultimate in my books.

 

Thinking about it, I think it would be best for 5043 to lead. I'm not sure it would be right for an Earl to be behind a Princess. Ahem.

 

Propelling is banned on the mainline, so it seems quite obvious that Lizzie will have to go inside 5043

*runs to a place where Ralph won't find him*