Affinity to the Big Four

This is something that has interested me for a number of years and some threads on here just exacerbate my mystification regarding this - bear with me on this. Why do people still get so passionate (and in other cases angry) about other railway companies when nationalisation was over 60 years ago and why did they choose their own example (if they were lucky enough to choose)?

I will always have affection for the GWR having been born into a Swindon family where my predecessors served the GWR (and then WR) for 3 generations before me. However I am now in my mid thirties (1975 born) and thus never even knew steam on the national system let alone had any contact with the GWR. Therefore whilst I cannot deny a GWR bias (sure it never shows) I just love steam and would travel to see anything.

However I read some really strong vitriol on here at times against the GWR (and others I hasten to add), and don’t understand how people (especially those my age and below) can still feel so strongly about something that happened so many years ago, and in many cases they never experienced firsthand?

Apologies I have put this so dreadfully, but I am just interested how people have reached the positions they hold on such matters. Mods feel free to move etc if this is in the wrong place – let me know if you do though as if I come back and its gone I will get jolly confused!

 

My Grandfather was from Devon and wanted to be a premium apprentice on the GWR, although he ended up with the Metropolitan Railway and then the RFC. I inherited his bias I think.

 

Well my dad grew up with an ex-GW branchline at the bottom of his garden and so has an understandable GW bias, that has undoubtedly rubbed off on me. However as a kid i spent many hours at the SVR, i still do, and developed an LMS bias too, with locos like 48773, 2968 and 45110 around. As a result i hold both companies loco's in higher regard, with 2857 being something of a family loco it's held in the highest regard, than ex SR and LNER examples.

However, I would still be quite happy to turn up at the NYMR and get the Q6 hauling, or the MHR with a U boat, or the NNR with the B12. Bias for me, its just favouritism. I see no reason that it should descend into dislike and, as the OP said pure vitriol at times.

 

I grew up in Hampshire, but was a regular visitor to the SVR in my childhood due to it being very close to my Grandparents. I also got to the MHR fairly frequently. My preference if pressed is GWR closely followed by the Southern. My Grandfather with whom I visited the SVR however comes from an LMS family which complicates things further! No connection to the LNER but I do take a real interest in it as well, especially the original GCR.

So to sum up I'm actually into it all! I think that a lot of the 'vitriol' you see on here and elsewhere is tongue in cheek or at worst akin to different Football Club supporters - it does seem to get a bit silly sometimes though.

 

That is without touching on the 'anything outside of the British mainline' debate. For me steam is steam, the colour or origins are irrelevant. It's a good analogy about football clubs. So much wasted energy!

 

I've probably been responsible for some of the gentler ribbing against the GWR on occasion, which certainly goes against the grain considering that I live deep in former GWR territory, but I'll try explain the background to this in my round-about way:

GWR locomotives have never really appealed to me, as I believe they lack variety. What is more, they seem to attract a following (not everyone, but certainly a vocal minority) that dismisses everyone else out of hand. When I was very much younger, I had a colouring book of various British steam locomotive designs, and only one type with distinctive wheels jumped out at me; no guesses needed for what that type was! However, it wasn't until my first visit to the North Yorkshire Moors Railway in 2000 that I really started to get into my hitherto general interest in railways; a visit that prompted me to learn more about the type that attracted my interest all those years ago: the Bulleid Pacifics.

I was much less knowledgeable in those days, and I thought I was being hauled by either a 9F or even 'Britannia' because the locomotive looked very similar from my carriage at the back of the train. However, upon closer inspection at Grosmont, I recognised the distinctive wheel-pattern as being similar to that in the colouring book, but not only that, I also spied those three immortal words: "West Country Class". I had ridden behind my first Bulleid Pacific, No. 34101 Hartland. "But if it has the same wheel design, then why does it look different from the version in that old colouring book?", I asked myself. And so began the plunge into the fascinating complexities of the Bulleid Pacifics; that they were originally 'air-smoothed' with chain-driven valve gear, and were subsequently rebuilt to a design reminiscent of the BR standards. My interest grew to encompass all the myriad classes associated with this small railway, and I emerged a latter-day 'Southerner' in 2003.

I knew a teacher in school who was an LMS fanatic; a good chap, but very partisan towards 'his' railway. My grandfather was and still is an LMS enthusiast, whilst everyone else I met in the area were of the GWR camp (hardly anyone was of an LNER disposition). When I went to university, I frequently met members of the Railway Club of Wales in a pub in Swansea, a couple of whom were dyed-in-the-wool GWR fanatics who rated the bark of a Western locomotive above everything else on rails. Most members were rather more open-minded, and it was to these that I tended to gravitate. However, when I started to volunteer on my local railway, it turned out that I was the Southern cat amongst the GWR pigeons! Nonetheless, after countering much of the associated chaff, I think it is safe to say that I have nurtured a healthy, if grudging, respect for all things Southern amongst several members of the railway.

At the end of the day, it all boils down to my character; I've never been one to 'follow the crowd', and have always been happy to stand out as an individual as a result of this. This is why I have no time for the 'my railway is better than yours' mob, pretty much because they probably haven't thought about why they have fallen-in with the crowd, and tend to refer to 'Brasso' and the lack of cab doors for ease of evacuation when dealing with them. As ever, this is my opinion...

 

I was born in Redhill, Surrey, the grandson of a driver based at Ashford shed (74A/73F) while my other grandparents lived within sight of the LSWR West of England main line at Overton, and as a small child, my grandfather carried me down the garden on his shoulders to watch the "Atlantic Coast Express" pass by. No surprise where my "Big Four" affinities lie! However, if we're all honest, ultimately, whether, say, the A4s, Duchesses, Kings or Merchant Navys (or should it be Navies??) were the best is a matter of subjective opinion based on our personal history and geography. Sometimes, I do agree, some comments I have read (particularly about the GWR) can seem a bit more than tongue in cheek and a bit OTT, but in my opinion (for what it's worth) I think that the different design and styling of the Big Four companies' locos provides a welcome variety that is far greater than, say in Germany where although many of their steam locos are unquestionably fine machines, they do seem to look far more alike than ours do.

I visited the NYMR for the first time in ages three years ago, and was delighted that one of the locos in steam was the B1. Yes, I was able to enjoy a wonderful 18-mile trip behind 30926 Repton, which naturally I was delighted to see in steam, but I also made an effort to ensure that I could fit in a run from Grosmont to Goathland behind 61264, and enjoyed every minute of it. I now live away from my beloved Southern Region, having moved to Gloucestershire last November, and rest assured, I am looking forward to seeing No. 6024 at Gloucester on the Cathedrals Express on Thursday week as much as any died-in-the wool GWR fan.

I don't want to set myself up as any sort of paragon of virtue (I'm not!) but I would guess that I'm probably speaking for the majority in saying that I appreciate steam from all four "Big Four" companies, but will always have a totally subjective and irrational preference for one of those four.

 

Speaking personally, as someone who grew up in Norfolk and leans towards the LNER because it feels like my heritage, I'm a bit jealous that so much GWR has survived and, of course, the more locos there are the more fans from the next generation they attract. I think it speaks volumes that the GWR, with the most locos extant, also seems to have most of the active, progressed and supported new build schemes. So there you go, it's sour grapes! Actually, like all the posters above (I think) I just love steam, be it from any of the big four, or better still, pre-grouping. My favourite engine designer was not an LNER CME and funnily enough, as a small child I liked nothing better than a pannier tank, 'Duck' was my favourite Rev Awdry Character for quite a time. I have a feeling his constant faffing about being 'ship-shape and Swindon fashion' may be what put me off.

 

To a true railway enthusiast it doesn't matter what come over the hill, an enthusiast will enjoy the sight and sound and the engineering.

 

Having a favourite is fine IMHO. I grew up in Lancaster, but developed a passion for A4's after seeing 'The Elizabethan Express.' film at a railway club meeting in 1963. Trips to Newcastle, Glasgow and Aberdeen allowed me to 'cop' 15 out of 34 and even though I cleared all the LMS Pacifics (apart from 46202) I've retained a love of Streaks and the LNER to this day.

Early days as a volunteer at 'Steamtown' saw me working with LMS classes mainly, but I loved it when 61306 was painted in apple green for the first time! When SNG first came to stay I was in raptures and the A4 lads must have wondered who was constantly polishing all the brass and copperwork in cab when they were not around!

When 'Raveningham Hall' arrived from Barry - two of us climbed atop the smokebox to try and bring out the copper cap - it took hours but eventually we had a semi-shine going on.

I love em all really, but if there is a streak around, it will always take priority

 

Presumably the same event put you off poetry for life?!

 

Born and raised and sill live within earshot of the GN and a Gresley/LNER man through and through. Used to watch the trains on regular trips with my Dad to drop off the fish offal to a pig farmer who resided next to the line near Arlesey. Big soft spot for the SR too due to family connections in Sussex.

 

Wasn't that the "Night Mail" film? Could of been both. I have EE on super8 somewhere.

 

What appears to be the running theme is "first steam experience". For me that was true. Born 4 years after mainline steam was abolished in the south my first experience was the formation of the MHR. I remember all to well going there as a boy with my father and seeing 31874 on the first train. I remember 34016 in its "cocoon" and launch to traffic. The arrival of 120 and its transformation into BR Black 30120. 506 and 34105 at Alresford for the naming ceremony etc, etc. I remember the foundation of the Swanage Railway and travelling the short distance from the station to the engine shed and back. My true allegience is therefore to the Southern although as I've already stated, I don't remember seeing a Bulleid at speed on the ACE!

Saying that, I was in Devon in 1985 when the GWR 150 Celebrations were taking place and spending a long time at Newton Abbot admiring all the brass but still the Southern in me meant that I couldn't get all "starry eyed" like many there.

My "epiphany" didn't come for a long time after this though. When the MHR bought a Black 5 as their first owned loco, I thought they had made a huge mistake and should have stuck to their Southern routes but after seeing 45379 rise from the dead, return to steam and subsequently travel on it I found that there were good, nay, great engines built on other regions.

Although I will never lose my Southern bias, I will never dis another mans belief in their right to believe in the LNER, LMS or (dare I say it) GWR heritage. After all, if we all followed the SR, there would be no GWR, NE or LMS locos preserved to compare against. As is often said, variety is the spice of life and in steam preservation, long may that continue.

As for diesels, well that is another matter altogether!

 

In my case, my love of the GWR is largely thanks to the event that Western Region put on in 1985 to mark GW 150 year. I do agree with Victor though, I can certainly appreciate the good points of other companies locos in the same what I can accept that Western Machines have draw backs.

 

The're all good, but for me the GW is just a little bit better. Elegant lines, fabulous bark, and the nicest boilers. I'll forgive them (most) of their other problems - and there are many I admit.

 

Being born in Windsor and growing up in Bourne End, my father got me into everything brass and copper. Spent my younger years on family holidays at the SVR and llangollen and the Welshpool and Lanfair as well as Didcot. I also spent my youth at Taplow or Reading watching the last of the proper modern traction in the 1990's.

My first rail tour was with 6024 back in 1995 to Paignton (keith leech memorial train)and I was then hooked on mainline. I still have the picture of the young faced covered black with a smile under the destination board.

But as the years have gone by I have started to deviant to other lines, mainly the MHR and occasionly the GCR. I've
lived next to the ecml at hitchin for 7years now...and it still hasn't converted me! Only joking.

Interesting response from people on here. I'm leaning towards steam is steam.... But with still a soft spot to GWR

 

I grew up in north-east Scotland and have very fond childhood memories of 5025 working on the Strathspey and having family outings to chase other Black 5s (5305 and 5407, as they were then, were family favourites) across Scotland along with 60009 and 60532. My Dad wasn't too keen on 61994 and 62005 but I do remember seeing them in apple green on the WHE.

Summer holidays Cornwall would mean a stop at Highley on the way back north where I can remember 34027, 75069 (another favourite), 48773 and 'Raveningham Hall'.

I find it hard to have any particular loyalty to a company that ceased to exist many years before I was born but I have always admired the handsome lines of LMS engine and the ruggedness of the BR Standards more than any other type. When I started firing on the Strathspey Railway in 2002 we had 46512 and 80105 as our engines for the summer and I enjoyed all my days on them.

As a photographer I travel quite far to get a shot of Black 5s (although I enjoy photographing Britannias almost as much), so I guess I'm quite biased towards the LMS and BR Standards!