BR Standard class 6 No. 72010 'Hengist' and Clan Discussion Thread

Thanks Pesmo, you'll be more than welcome!
There's a members forum at Burton upon Trent on the 28th December where you will be able to ask question of the Council of Management and Engineering committee along with seeing some of the parts held in stock including the frame stretchers (if they haven't gone to Stephenson Engineering). Full details are on the website.
Dave

 

A very good turnout at yesterdays Members Forum at Burton upon Trent especially a good number of new members. We are now only 4 members away from 200! Those present were given an engineering update by Geoff Turner as well as a membership update from Allan Jones followed by a Q&A session. The second half of the forum consisted of a guided tour of parts held in stock at Nemesis including the very impressive new stretchers. The photos don't do them justice in terms of size and sale of these critical components.
As a bonus we received nearly £800 in donations and also some sales of our shed plate and engine plate fridge magnets that are available at only £1 each.
We estimate that around £100,000 is required to complete the frame assembly of which we already have have £46,000.
2013 is closing on a positive note with the frames now profiled and machined ready for the welding in of the horn guides in January and the ordering of the final combined stretcher which is expected to be cast in January and delivered in February.
2014 promises to be a very promising and productive year which will start with the ordering of further frame components including the exhaust steam spider, smokebox saddle, firebox supports and slide bar brackets. One question that is often asked is why we are ordering the slide bar brackets this early on? The answer is that so many of the machined holes in the frames are used to secure more than one component such as stretchers and brackets. While we could temporarily bolt components in and have a temporary frameset almost immediately it is felt that it will be best to assemble everything in one go to save on the expense of keep setting up the components and machines only to then move the whole assembly and repeat several times. The 'all at once' approach will also ensure that all datums and alignments are only setup once so ensuring accuracy of assembly.
We would like to thank everyone for their support during 2013, it has certainly been a year that has tested the metal of those involved with the project and of our members and supporters who have unequivocally supported the decisions made and the progress achieved.
Happy New Year!

From us all at the Clan Project.

 

The above makes impressive reading for a project so nearly abandoned a couple of years ago, well done to all concerned. Yes, I am biased!

 

Thanks John. Sorry for the lack of updates, but what a month...
February Round Up

My how time flies! It's been a while since I last posted a news update but that doesn't mean a lot hasn't been going on! Quite the opposite!
Third combined frame stretcher

Hot off the presses is the news that the third and final combined frame stretcher has been cast at Norton Cast Products! We await the test results but this should bring to a close one of the most challenging aspects of the project to date. Full credit to Norton Cast Products' team and our engineering team for achieving what was starting to look impossible. One offs of such complexity are not favoured by foundries as the first casting can eat away the profit if the casting process fails.
As soon as I receive the photos they will be added to the website!
Slide bar bracket casting

We will shortly be placing an order for the two slide bar bracket castings.
Fabricated stretchers

We will shortly be placing an order for the remaining fabricated stretchers. These, along with the slide bar bracket, will complete the set of components required to start the frame assembly.
Machining and assembly

A new section title!
Stephenson Engineering have completed work to prepare the horn guides to be welded into the frames. This marks the first assembly work on the new frames and the start of many news updates I'm sure!
Funding

The ordering of the last components is great news from the project and really shows just how far we have come along in the last 2 years. We have only been able to do this through the dedciation of the team behind the project and our members and supporters.
We now need to look forward 12 months to the start of the frame component maching and assembly at Ian Riley & Son (Bury) and at Stephenson Engineering.

We Need You!

Please consider donating the price of a coffee a week, if all our members alone did this we would raise over £2,400 per month or £28,800 in the next 12 months. Add Gift Aid at 25% and that would equal a stagering £36,000! Donations can be made on the website at www.72010-hengist.org or via postal donations using teh donation form available at www.72010-hengist.org/portabledocs/DonationForm2014.pdf

 

Is the smokebox saddle fabrication included in the fabricated stretchers which you are having done? I would of thought that this is critical to the assembly stage, being the biggest stretcher.

 

The smokebox saddle fabrication is included as is the casting for the exhaust steam spider (required to be welded into the saddle fabrication prior to fitting between the frames).

 

Thank you for the quick reply.

 

Carole Cuneo, President of the Clan Project for ten years, has decided with deep regret, that due to personal reasons she is unable to continue with her presidency of the project. She has said however, that she still supports the group whole heartedly and wishes it every success for the future and that if there is any way that she can help with the furtherance of the project's aims then she will help in any way she can.
Carole's role as President, has been filled with the appointment of James S. Baldwin, who has taken up this position with immediate effect.
'Jim' is a life long railway enthusiast, historian, writer and professional film producer. His railway activities past and present include: Producing the official NRM FLYING SCOTSMAN boxed set of films; writing several books about FLYING SCOTSMAN - the latest, to be published this spring, with a major launch in North America; Advising a client on how to set-up a steam operated tourist railway in Vietnam, due to open in 2017; Ambassador to the British Postal Museum and Archive’s Mail Rail Project, helping to reopen part of the former Post Office Railway in London as a Tourist Attraction; Communications Director of the British International Railway Museum, working to repatriate British built engines from abroad for display in a purpose built museum; Member of the All Party Group on Heritage Railways at the House of Commons, arranging guest speakers, briefing parliamentarians about heritage railways; Member of several railway groups; Well connected in the railway industry, including Train Operating Companies and preservationists; First hand experience in the conservation, preservation and operation of steam locomotives.
Jim said "I'm very honoured to take up this position and I look forward to working with this pragmatic team of people on the Clan project. I’m committed to excellence in all that I do and look forward to helping this project move forward." In his role as President, Jim is actively pursuing various funding schemes to further the aims of the Clan Project and urges anyone keen to see a Clan type locomotive running again to join the group now.

 

Joint Press Release from the Clan Project and 5AT Group

The Clan Project is pleased to announce that they have asked the 5AT Group to carry out a Feasibility Study to look at improving the performance of 72010 to make it suitable for the 21st century railway. The Feasibility Study will look at the exhaust system, boiler, piston valves and pistons. The improvements are targeted at performance and economy.

Before development stopped on steam locomotives, British Railways were looking at further improvements to the draughting, beyond those carried out to the initial batch of locomotives. This approach is consistent with the intention to build 72010 with the modifications proposed for the cancelled second batch of locomotives.

The 5AT Group, in partnership with the Keighley and Worth Valley Railway, has recently completed the installation of a Lempor Exhaust on ex- US Army Transportation Corp S160 No 5820.

Geoff Turner – Engineering Director of the Clan Project commented – “This is a wonderful opportunity to further enhance the design of the ‘Clans’ as a continuation of the 1954 design improvements. The 5AT group have a great deal of knowledge from design work undertaken for the 5AT locomotive which can be incorporated into the development of the ‘Clan’ making it a suitable locomotive for the 21st Century and to keep up with the latest requirements for mainline operations.”

John Hind – Chairman of the 5AT Group commented - “A great deal has been learnt during the 5AT project that applies to steam locomotives of all types, and we are excited to use the legacy of 5AT for the benefit of the Clan Project ”

 

If we wanted a larger boiler we'd have built / rebuilt a Brit
The 5AT Group will do a thorough job and we look forward to the results. Interestingly BR were already looking at improvements as part of lot 242 (the designs we are following) and with todays Technical design and simulation tools this will be something worth watching!

 

Doesn't need one. The evaporation will go up and the specific steam consumption down giving a much improved performance without significant weight penalty. If any. A modern version of the boiler with a higher working pressure and better superheater could be useful though, and again, no, or very little, weight penalty.

 

Already some lively and interesting debate, keep it up!
Nothing is beyond possibility, after all with modern boiler insulating materials being thinner the boiler could be bigger without affecting the overall look of the engine. Would it be worth the hassle of getting a new design certified for that small increase?

Don't read anything official into the above, they are just my ramblings. I'm as intrigued as the rest of you to see what the 5AT guys come up with. The one certainty is that before any design changes are agreed the membership will get their say. If you want a say join up today!

 

I have been inclined to a similar view: even given the post-war need for fireboxes to be somewhat larger than before in relation to other dimensions, it seems hardly necessary for the Class 6 to have been designed with a wide firebox and the consequent need for trailing wheels. So the Clan new build has been well down the list of projects that I have felt any inclination to support. BUT the news of the 5AT partnership puts a very different complexion on it. Even a modest dose of the Chapelon/Porta/Wardale improvements should make the new Clan at least the equal of a Class 7, and perhaps even a Class 8.

 

Class 7 would be easy enough. It will depend on the Std Class 6 Group and how far they would be prepared to allow the design to be adjusted. Much that could be done would not be noticable visually. B.R. were going to improve the design so that rather opens the door to a wide range of possibilities that were available at the time but were neither used or considered. I await the Naysayers.

 

At the moment nothing is out of the question and all avenues are being explored. At the end of the day we want a reliable and efficient loco.
The Lot 242 changes were numerous and some have already been incorporated such as the combined lower stretchers and spring hangar brackets. How far we go is very much dependent on gains vs cost vs reliability. A reliable Clan with Class 7 stats is far more useful than an unreliable and costly to maintain Clan with Class 8 stats.
This will be a very interesting year!

 

Were are you going to store all the additional paperwork?

 

Not quite sure what you mean std tank?
All of our hard copy paperwork is scanned and then filed. The scans are then stored in our document database for access by the group and interested parties such as our certification body.

 

There is a substantial amount of paper work to be completed for a new boiler to the present B.R. design. If you start tinkering with that design then, I would have thought, the paperwork increases accordingly, whether it is scanned or not.