Dining trains VFM

Are heritage railway dining trians value for money?

Ive been looking with a view to taking my family of 4 for Sunday lunch next year but the prices (even when you subtract the travel element) when compared to even the best pubs look to be on the high side.

A simple sample of railways showed Sunday lunch prices to be in the £45-55 range, subtract £15-20 for the travel and you are left with a lunch cost in the region of £30-35. The best pubs in my area charge only around £20 for 3 courses, many are more in the £15 region. Thus the average railway Sunday lunch is quite a bit more expensive than the alternative of a very decent pub.

My own view is that most railway dining trains sell out, ergo the market must be prepared to pay this premium, but can this premium be justified and is it worth it.

I know the response that I will get when I tell my wife that a proposed Sunday lunch on a steam train will be 60-100% more than the equivalent in the pub.

 

The premium doesn't need to be justified per se - you've answered your own question, if the line has a train that seats say 100 and can mostly sell 100 tickets at its current prices, why lower them?

 

But the pub doesn't have a steam railway to run. "Value for money" is hugely subjective.

 

its more to do with what else your offering, Dining on a train is, or should be sold as an adventure, something out of the ordinary, its not just about the meal, its the expperience, its high class dining, made to feel like your more than just a customer, yes you can get a decent Sunday lunch in a pub, but its just that a meal , your not getting anything else,

 

There's a huge competition in the pub trade over Sunday lunches. By themselves, they have no USP so it is largely down to perceived value for money, quality and convenience. Dining on a steam hauled train, especially in a Pullman or other superior coach with silver service, provides that USP that enables a premium to be charged. As a volunteers on the NYMR, if there are spare seats on a diner, we are offered them at a lower price. That opportunity rarely happens, though, because there are rarely spare seats.

 

It depends, ultimately, whether your priority is the food or the travel. I would travel on the train but eat "on land". A Michelin approved establishment is unlikely to charge more.

PH

 

I think you have answered your own question!

Ultimately only you can form an opinion of whether paying that price represents VFM for you, but looking at the market as a whole, if the trains are selling out, there must be a large number of people who think the premium is justified and worth it.

Tom

 

I am assuming that the steam railway to run is covered by the fare element of the dining ticket.

What Im questioning is whether the 60-100% increase over a good pub price is worth it for the surroundings of a "superior coach with silver service" as quoted by Steve above (and good pubs do have nice surroundings and great service too). To me, as an enthusiast it might be, to the rest of the family its almost certainly not. But as I said and has been pointed out most diner sell out so there is a market willing to pay this premium.

 

Value for money is very subjective. What is overpriced for some will be a fair price to others. No organisation that sells out - pub, dining car or whatever - needs to reduce it's prices.

 

It's always a bit difficult to make binary classifications of "enthusiast / non-enthusiast". But my subjective view of the clientele on the dining train I'm most familiar with is that it is somewhat demographically distinct from the passengers on the service trains. That suggests to me that it is primarily catering for people looking for a meal, and finding a way to make that meal memorable (perhaps in connection with a special occasion such as a significant birthday, anniversary etc.); rather than primarily being aimed at finding something additional for already-committed rail enthusiasts to do. It's a luxury product; possibly something that many people may only do once per year, if that; bought well in advance and looked forward to. So in terms of VFM, you need to compare with other luxury experiences you might occasionally buy, rather than consider it as being an alternative to your regular Sunday pub lunch.

Tom

 

My neighbour recently dined at a Michelin 2 star restaurant & said the food was very good, but not worth the premium price of almost £200 per head.

Personally I would rather dine on the move & last weekend ate very well for under £5 - from a burger van at the East Lancs Railway. It may not have had two Michelin stars, but it was running on four Michelin tyres.

 

Have eaten on the 'Limited' at the SVR a few times and have to say yes it's a bit expensive but the food and the service are certainly worth paying that little bit more for. It's not something to do every week but for treat or for something special like a birthday or anniversary it's well worth it. I can can pop into one of the pubs in my village and I can have an okay Sunday lunch for about £10 £15, I can go into town and pay a bit more in somewhere like Midsomer House which has a Michelin Star, I can combine 2 of my hobbies and have a decent meal in 1930's Great Western Stock, receive silver service, enjoy a little drop of something I like whilst enjoying the sight and sound of a loco at work. I know which ones worth paying a little bit more for.

 

Nothing like a bit of reconstituted bovine lips and rectum to get the taste buds salivating is there.

 

Each to their own, I guess. Ate very well and burger is a bit of an oxymoron, though, whatever the price..

 

suspect railways have to pay VAT on the full price (including train fare) too, which will bump the price up!!!???

 

Its not what it is, its how well its done. For our wedding my wife & I had Fish & Chips followed by Treacle Tart (Not at Spamcans I'm afraid) Everyone enjoyed it,and it was done to a high standard.

I've had some excellent burgers/Fish & Chips/Transport Café Breakfasts and some rather forgettable 'haute cuisine'

 

I think I have dined on trains (other than BR/Virgin) three times. An undistinguished Mk 1 25 years ago so not reflective of the current market and two different but enjoyable trips:

An Orient Express from Victoria which was excellent and pricey. Quality ambience, good company and excellent food. We expensed the bill

At the other end was a Severn Valley DMU fish and chips this year - the last of the season. I think again the clientele were different from enthusiasts and I thoroughly enjoyed sitting in a DMU with the sound of pleasant relaxed adult conversation and diesel engines. The conversation was not enthusiasts, drunks or children showing off, it was the sort you would have on a service train 30 years ago. That was different and I enjoyed it. Probably the only trip where I had a salt cellar, ketchup bottle and knife and fork in my rucksack at the start. And you could not fault the VFM.

 

Nothing wrong with fish and chips and I've had them at weddings, too. I'd draw the line at a burger, though and if it's going to be a so-called artisan burger, I'd prefer to have the meat as a steak rather than minced up and mixed with onions and whatever else someone decides to put in it. I just can't see the point. Well, I can; its to disguise something that you might otherwise not want to eat.

 

Somebody just 'rubbed' the 'tax' lamp? The tax genie duly appears!

No! 2 separate supplies - tested by VSOE (saying the meal was incidental to the rail journey and failed if I recall without logging in to online text books) but point proven - 2 supplies of equal importance to the customer, and therefore with differing VAT treatments.

Steven

 

And, if I recall, why many railways show their dining trains in the public timetable with at least a modicum of public accommodation.