Flying Scotsman

Fred, it was a publicity stunt for the media and to advertise a new era on the ECML and as such it succeeded by getting airtime on TV and extensive newspaper coverage. You didn't support it, you went to see it and chose the wrong location with the benefit of hindsight, something I've done on many occasions. Blame Mr Sod and his infernal law. If you are going to get stressed every time this happens, for the good of your health, I would suggest you give up this hobby and take up stamp collecting.

 

To be fair to NR, testing is a time consuming operation, as can be seen from this video of the gauge testing unit in action:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1711228495570579

 

But not at the point where they had asked the public to gather (via official signs and a field turned into a car park), that was the point I was making.

 

And as such people have a right to complain - though to Virgin (who seem to have been the ones calling the shots with the whole thing) and not NR or the NRM.

Whether Virgins press office give a damn about a bunch of lineside photographers to admit to making errors is another thing - after all it did what they wanted (got the brand splashed all over the media)

 

Nah mate, the gauging trolley is painted bright yellah

 

Don't forget it hasn't been just Richard Branson/Virgin who have run the "Publicity" machine to highlight their latest product. Their East Coast predecessor the London & North Eastern Railway were equally as adept. Here are a few examples the S & D centenary in 1925, the record run down Stoke Bank with 4468 on the 3rd July 1938 and most connected to this topic the 1938 introduction of the new Flying Scotsman train set. The Stirling Single No1 was removed from the old Queen Street Museum in York and overhauled. A long with the Locomotive they rounded up a selection of G.N./E.C.J.S. six wheelers which were also overhauled to represent the 1888+/- Flying Scotsman set. The "Press" were invited to have a trip, so No1 and set left Kings Cross and ran to Stevenage. Where across the platform was 4498 Sir Nigel Gresley [and it's namesake too] complete with the new 1938 'Scotsman set, the Press had a good look and comparison of both sets before returning the 'Cross with 4498 hauling the 1938 set.

 

Sorry Fred - you should know better than to take as gospel what you read on Nat Pres. I have the operating instructions, dated 15/4/17, which clearly state that on departure from the photo location at the Sidings Restaurant "Azuma sounds Warning and accelerates from a standing start to lead the pack towards" the possession exit before Skelton Bridge Junction. This is exactly what happened. No one over-rode the organisers at all. It all went to plan. The problem seems to me to be that while the public were encouraged to view the spectacle from Overton Bridge the organisers did not anticipate a public wish to see the trains in staggered formation at that point. And why should they? There was no need to involve the public at all for what was after all a company promotional film shoot. Not everyone understands our sometimes mad and obsessive hobby and I doubt it even occured to them that there was anything wrong with the formation that went forward from the Sidings.

It could of course have been so much worse - at least the Azuma was a good train length ahead of the "pack", otherwise the A3 would have been blocked from view, which suggests that some thought went into staging even this section of the exercise.

Peter James

 

I suspect you're hoping that torgormaig's post will settle the matter. Wouldn't hold your breath on that.

 

Agreed that the event went as per the operating instructions (not available to the public) but NOT as the Press Release (which was available to the public) hence there have been representations made to all parties which I understand will be brought up at the review meeting. As Macko notes even the stewards on the day were unaware of the "operating instructions" so I think that "shambles" well defines the event as far as communications and the public is concerned.

My concern is that the NRM involvement in the fiasco will only further diminish the support for the NRM which - as far as many of the public were concerned - was one of the organisers. As a supporter of the NRM this is not a situation that I enjoy and - despite Spamcam81's comment - I raised the concern of many hence am glad that those concerns will be discussed at the review meeting.

To quote a phrase - if nowt is said then nowt is done; the NRM is now aware of public concerns and it is now time to wait until the next NRM event occurs to see what "lessons have been learned".

 

You're seemingly getting yourself in quite a state over this Fred. Given the success of @Spamcan81's request to the NRM re-LSWR 563 perhaps you should consider writing to them over this ?


Jon

 

'Fiasco'? Really? I don't wish to pull the whole 'children dying in Syria' thing but I think you need to see some perspective. 'One train pulls ahead of another three trains earlier than expected in publicity event' is hardly the most terrible thing to happen to the NRM in the last few years, let alone in the world in general.

 

There has been a subtle change in the structure gauge. Once upon a time there were minimum requirements for all new works (the Blue Book), although grandfather rights applied to lines built before these came in. This generally required a bridge/tunnel height of 15ft above the middle of the track (see http://85a.co.uk/forum/gallery/2/original/2_040252_350000001.gif) Now the requirements for the structure gauge have changed. The latest Railway Safety Principles simply states:
Principle 2.5: Clearances for trains There should be adequate and sufficient clearances between trains on adjacent tracks and between trains and structures and fixed equipment to ensure safe passage.
It should be noted that this requirement only applies to trains that are normally required to operate over the route.

 

Losing the will to live. There's good news stories everywhere in railway preservation recently but some people will try to drag it all down.

Tornado does a hundred? Oh apparently that's making older steam locomotives look bad.

Swanage get the T3? The NRM is destroying the national collection!

Azuma pulls ahead in a very early morning one off for a filming event? End of the world is nigh!

Can we please get a grip fellas.

 

According to other posts it was a VTEC event and the Azuma was scheduled to pull ahead where it did. Quite why the NRM should get flak over this is a mystery to me.

 

Indeed, the NRM encouraged people in their press release to view from York station: 'The best view of the action will be from York station – where a giant screen will broadcast footage of the trains live, and members of the public are advised to head to the station.'

 

+1

 

So, let me try and get a handle on this. VTEC stage what is ultimately an advert for their new trains - an event which is being recorded/filmed. After them all running parallel for a while, the Azuma pulls ahead. To me that's saying "here's our heritage: now, let's rush forward to a new future with our new trains" and at this point, the Azuma breaks from the pack and speeds off.

Yeah, sounds like a typical advert to me. The rest is just incidental to the action and as @Spamcan81 and @S.A.C. Martin have said, perhaps in not so many words - why are people giving the NRM so much stick? All I can see is the involvement of 60103 and D9002 in one train.

Good Lord...

 

Perhaps if the NRM had been less prominent in publicising this, they might have had less flak at the way it turned out. I certainly didn't realise how much it was a VTEC event until some of the more recent posts.