GWR: the case for more replicas.

Given time I'm sure Bullied, with his interesting view of development, would have articulated his spam cam and added a 2nd tender at the front of it.
Then it'd be known as a Trolley full of Spam

 

I think he meant 'really significant locos of that period', as in practical terms the designs (early-mid 19th century ones) would not pull the trains required on many preserved lines (or main line trains). At the moment the Beamish fleet, along with 'Planet', 'Rocket' etc. generally represent significant advancements in loco design and also have a 'Novelty' factor (heh heh heh).

 

That"s what i meant. There might perhaps be an opening for a complete replica vintage train both for operation as a special feature and for film work. With the latter in mind, rather than anything too distinctive to a specific company such as the Great Western, maybe something like a Jenny Lind or a Sharp Single might have more commercial appeal, metamorphosising into different prototypes by a bit of repainting. (Such as an ex Shrewsbury and Birmingham in GWR livery!)

 

Being a type synonymous with the LBSCR, a Jenny Lind is one of those lost classes that is periodically discussed in Bluebell messroom circles.

However, on the tripartite "is it buildable, fundable, useful?" criterion, it probably falls down on buildable. One of the features that made the originals so successful was a large firebox, indeed the largest that could be accommodated, thus making the locos good steam raisers for their time. This was achieved by virtue of the front inside frames only supporting the leading and driving wheels. They were then stopped at the firebox rather than continuing to the trailing wheels, allowing the firebox to be wider as it only needed to fit between the outside frames, not the inside ones. The front inside frames were securely fastened to the front of the firebox, so that the rigidity and strength of the design derived from the fact that the frames and boiler were essentially one integral component. That has obvious maintenance problems, because the frames and boiler cannot be readily separated, and it would not be easy to periodically inspect the boiler behind the outside frames, since it couldn't be removed easily from the loco.

You could overcome those problems by designing a much narrower firebox, but at that point you don't have a Jenny Lind, and in particular you have taken away one of the features that was responsible for the success of the design.

I'd love to see more mid-nineteenth century engines. However, you essentially run into several problems, even beyond the technical ones. Firstly, no-one remembers such engines, so there is no ready support base of spotters who remember them from their youth. (Those aren't the only people who fund new builds of course, but I suspect they make up a core of many groups). Then you have the problem that there were myriad companies, none of which individually has a critical mass of support. The fact that many companies bought essentially off-the-shelf designs from private locomotive builders is only a help if you envisage batch building, with different locos turned out in Midland, Brighton, Great Eastern etc forms, but that is even further removed from reality! And then the final problem is that a loco from the 1850s is going to look silly without carriages of similar vintage, so the cost goes up and the likely lines goes down - and the probable train loadings might be 100 or so passengers, which makes it a niche activity on the larger lines that typically have 300 - 400 capacity trains, and unaffordable for the smaller lines that do run trains of that sort of capacity.

I suspect you are really into sugar-daddy territory...(*)

Tom

(*) That is my deliberate hostage to fortune to automatically cause an announcement about a Craven 2-4-0 and a train of Craven carriages to be made later this afternoon ...

 

I have to hand it to you Tom. A GWR replica thread and you manage to get both a Brighton and Bluebell angle on it. Well done.

 

Oh dear, the integral boiler problem would also affect my pipe dream of a Corsair replica!

 

To be fair, someone else raised the Jenny Lind first

And to be serious: despite my Brighton leanings, if I was in sugar-daddy mode, I can see the logic that a significant section of Broad gauge (or mixed gauge) track and loco / stock would be a significant "missing link" in heritage terms, probably more so than a lot of standard gauge mid-Victorian engines I could mention.

Tom

 

the point is there are quite a few LBSCR locos preserved

 

GWR Nos 5 and 6 were Terriers; green paint and brass numberplates anyone?

 

De Glehn Atlantic? Or even a 46xx 4-4-2 tank?

 

I'll allow you them, although they could be argued to be Churchward

 

In spite of my healthy disdain for all things GWR , I couldn't agree more. It is a great shame that we only have those few yards of broad gauge at Didcot. Would be nice to allow Firefly to stretch its legs a bit.

 

Do you know, I've never noticed that! You really need to get off the fence some time...

Tom

 

"Being a type synonymous with the LBSCR, a Jenny Lind is one of those lost classes that is periodically discussed in Bluebell messroom circles"

Please excuse my lateral thinking and drifting off topic; Jenny Lind was an opera singer who became the mistress of one of the LBSCR directors. He thought so much of her, he named the first loco of the class after her. Now the Victorians theoretically had higher morals than we have today. Oddly though no director of any of today's TOCs has (AFAIK) named a loco after his current mistress.

 

Ive often thought that with the increased number of railtours that seem to be occurring on the LT transport, it might be a pretty good idea to build a replica of a 97xx just to make things a LITTLE less smokey. In actual fact, a conversion of a 57xx might work better. There are a number of ex Barry examples that surely would provide a good starting point. Just a thought like...

 

As much smoke, but less steam. If you want less smoke you need to look at Fowler's Ghost....mixed gauge on the underground. - this is getting surreal.

Oh, though Fowler's Ghost didn't make smoke it failed to make steam either

 

Ignoring the first bit I've always thought that a Broad Gauge rebuild of Kemble - Tetbury would be a good scheme. Kemble still has the separate platform & run round area; Tetbury is an attractive town to visit; tourists already visit the area &the route itself appears largely intact.

 

Please tell us where the ex Barry examples are for this scheme. As far as I can tell all the ex Barry panniers already have a working role in their current guise with only one yet to steam (9629 which is under active restoration).