Borders Railway Steam Services - Autumn 2015

I,m a bit confused Fred on the pacifics changing at Carlisle ,can you enlarge.

 

The terminus at Tweedbank was redesigned at a late stage to have capacity for 12 coaches, with charters specifically in mind, but no run-round facilities so topping and tailing essential. A steamer at each end sounds good!

There are no passing loops as such, but three sections of double track, each a few miles long, so again no constraints as to the length of the train.

Peter on another sunny Manchester morning
http://pjhtransportpix.zenfolio.com/ .

 

Simple, Edinburg to Carlisle ,A3.Carlisle to Leeds Jubilee or Black 5 ,Leeds to St Pancras Jubilee or Black 5. I done the trip several times ,can bore you with the loco numbers if you like. The Edinburg's were the only sleepers to change engines at Carlisle. St Pancras to Glasgow sleepers, Royal Scot Class Glasgow to Leeds .London Euston to Glasgow ,Duchess Crewe to Glasgow. London Euston to Perth Duchess, Crewe to Perth. I was at Carlisle station doing a all nighter ,when a Duchess on the Perth sleeper staled on Shap ,the driver refusing a banker staled near Shap summit ,the following sleeper ,to Glasgow, was already on its way after stopping at Tebay for a banker. The three loco's couldn't start the train and another 2-6-4T was sent for from Tebay the four loco' s successfully starting the two trains. How do I know ?I caught the Glasgow ,an enthusiast was in the first compartment of the first coach and gave me the info'.
The day time St Pancras to Edinburg and Glasgow's had the same combination of loco's.

 

I'm not sure that that was always the case. I recollect in the early 1960s when travelling on the Waverley sleeper that 46244 was in Carlisle's centre road facing south and an unidentifiable Jubilee was in the station area facing north (changeover for Stranraer perhaps ?). In the same vein during 1962 Haymarket did trial an A4 working through from Edinburgh to Leeds on the Waverley sleeper, returning with the daytime northbound Waverley. Sadly the trial finished a month before my then annual visit to Edinburgh on the Waverley and the Royal Scot working throughout from St Pancras to Leeds was replaced by 44852 for the Leeds - Carlisle leg and an A3 from Carlisle.

 

No ,of course it wasn't always the case ,I was talking about the booked workings. I've just dusted my note books for the mid fifties and the only difference on my 5 trips between Edinburgh - Carlisle -St Pancras( or vv ) to "as booked "was on Sunday 24/04/1955, when D30 62436 Lord Glenvarlock piloted A3 60101 Cicero on the overnight. A mate of mine ,a railway fireman who always went shed bashing in his overalls ,got a ride on the D30 from Hawick to Carlisle and was told it was going on loan to Carlisle Canal. He also stopped over at Carlisle for a few hours and caught the day time Waverley south, and was hauled by a Polmadie Clan ,72001 Clan Cameron .That had replaced the booked loco' due to a derailment at Kingmoor shed .I whished I had stayed with him as I never had a ride behind a Clan, not due to the lack of trying though.
In the early sixties all manor of things happened due to the advent of diesel and the unexpected failures .The A4 trails in 1962 mentioned seem to me to be a bit strange ,as the St Pancras to Glasgow's and Edinburg were dieselized that year. There was a trail in 1954 with a A3, for the possibility of one engine working from Leeds to Edinburgh, the Scottish region was none to keen as it upset all their loco' diagrams , so although successful it only lasted one week. In 1960 The N E region ,which Leeds Holbeck was part of by then ,replaced all the L M S Royal Scots with A3s for trains to Scotland. Due to the arrival of diesels all were transferred away in about one year ,one lingered on to cover diesel failers a year or so longer. The Leeds Royal Scots were transferred to Western Division of the Midland region ,who sorted the best ones out and kept, sending the worst to the Midland, hence Scots appearing on St Pancras to Leeds trains ,however only for a year or so due to diesel replacements.

 

Not so if you recall that Haymarket was looking or extra work to retain the A4s in traffic whilst the Peaks were operated out of Leeds where the Waverley and Thames-Clyde had operated on loco changes at Carlisle. I'm not sure when the through workings from Leeds ceased to change locos at Carlisle but I suspect that in the 1960s it was as much a case of depots looking to retain depot work as much as dieselisation per se hence Haymarket looking to use the longer range of the A4s rather than be involved with the Leeds-based Class 45s.

Unfortunately I don't have notes so am dependant on memory but I seem to recall that the 1960s transfer of Royal Scots included some to Nottingham (46100 / 112 included) where 46100 frequently worked the St Pancras - Nottingham leg of the daytime Waverley and 46112 worked the daily "Robin Hood" Nottingham - St Pancras service. Both of these passed my then school at Corby hence the certainty of the memory. When the Royal Scots worked through to Leeds from St Pancras I recall that it was the 55A-based ones including 46130 / 145 that were transferred from the Midland Lines in the 1960s as the 45/ 46 takeover began; again I was hauled by the daytime Waverley from Nottingham in 1961 when 46130 worked throughout hence my certainty of the memory.

 

Leeds Royal Scots worked thro' from Leeds to Glasgow from at least since1948 ,no change at Carlisle on the Thames Clyde or Sleeper. In Glasgow if you made your first visit of the day in the mid fifties to 67A Corkerhill Glasgow ,two Leeds Scots would be present,one being prepared for the Thames Clyde and another being disposed of after working the overnight. The reason for the Waverley route loco change was because it was NB/LNER to MR/LMS . If it had been the case of A4 s working from Edinburg to Leeds ,they for sure would not of been manned by Haymarket men from Carlisle to Leeds. The Kingmoor and Leeds branches of ASLEF would never agree. If diesels came they came ,depots couldn't wriggle out. Haymarket men would have to learn the diesels the same as any other depot and accept the redundancies.

 

Might it have been that the very, very worst were reserved for the former GC section and the woe-begotten Marylebone-Nottingham Victoria semi fast service that lingered through this period?. I recall a couple of batches allocated to Annesley in 1962, (replacing Britannias, I think), that included 46111/ 43/ 53/ 58, and later 46125/ 6/ 67. Were they all part of this transfer....or at least the tail end of a cascade based on it??

 

I 'm afraid it wouldn't be possible to keep track on all the Scot movements 1960/4 ,they moved about monthly,some went to depots on loan ,a number were stored at Devon's Road shed (East London),only to put back into service in the bad Winter of 1962.The list you give were not according to my records ones allocated to the Midland , so they were probably ones shuffled about on the western division. On the midland I noted 46100,46112 ,46123,46139,46140,46157 and 46162. (probably not complete due to short term loans ).46100, one of the first to be transferred to the Midland in 1960 ,was a particularly rough example. Scots were a very good engine but when they got rough they certainly were rough, brick arches would collapse ,some drivers would fail the loco straight away, others if not far away from their destination would help the fireman get some coal on top of the collapsed arch and soldier on.It was no surprise that 46100 was one of the first to be withdrawn in 1962.

 

Now that the new railway is about to open, have any mileages being published for track bashers such as myself?

 

http://www.unusualtrack.co.uk/Layouts/UT_RL.htm

The new track diagram and mileages are on the Borders Line link on the left of this page.

 

Many thanks for this info, will be useful when I travel the new track and of course for others doing the same.

 

Latest news thanks to Robert Sherwood. <BJ>
''60009 Union of South Africa depart Hood Bridge 18:30
heading back to Buckfastleigh on light engine test run.''

 

I see 45407 is deputising for No. 9 on Sunday's Forth Circle tours. I wonder if she's also the stand-by loco for Wed & Thu opening specials? It would seem to be a good idea to have a "plan B", just in case...

 

45407 works back to Fort William on Monday.

 

Heritage Railway had Tornado listed as official standby.

 

More seats now available, an extra carriage will be added to 16 of the 17 journeys:

https://twitter.com/ScotRail/status/639089987007463424

 

News from SWRG suggests that 60009 will set off from Buckfastleigh this evening. <BJ>

''60009 To work 5Z28 Totnes to Laira to Bristol Barton Hill''.