Livery changes

On Facebook, some people posted "Why has Flying Scotsman been given a new number? I thought it was always 4472 and why is it painted dark green"?
Presumably that poster was a member of the general public and not a rail enthusiast, which set me wondering.
In my inherited photo collection in late 1949 quite a few locos were still in the livery of one of the big four companies. Does anyone know please when the last big four livery was replaced by that of British Railways?
Going further back; after the Grouping of 1923 did the new companies rush to get all locos and rolling stock into the new colours, or was it carried out at the next scheduled repaint?
Thanks in advance.

 

There are photographs around of steam engines with GWR and variations on that theme on them into the 1960s. I would imagine a fair few went to the scrap yard in that state.

 

I'm sure we had a thread on a similar subject a couple of years back.

Last pre-grouping livery I am aware of on the SR was, from memory, an LBSCR Terrier which lasted to 1930 before being repainted. Interestingly, it was by then SECR No. 751 (the one now preserved as No 54 "Waddon" in Canada) and the pre-grouping livery it was in was SECR, not LBSC!

Generally front-line locomotives were repainted about every three years or so, goods and shunting locos maybe a bit longer between repaints, so a pre-grouping livery on a loco lasting into 1925/6 wasn't too uncommon, but much beyond that was generally for oddities. Interestingly, there were at least a couple of Drummond T9s which were fitted with superheaters in 1925/26 but which kept their LSWR livery despite the significant works attention, as the original paint was still considered to be in good condition. Similarly, at least one of the ex-LSWR O2 tanks was fitted with air brakes by the SR and shipped to the Isle of Wight still in LSWR livery. See photo 228 here: http://1920slocomotives.blogspot.co.uk/2014/04/226-230-curious-lswr-bunch.html

Post nationalisation, I think the last SR locos to get BR livery were in about 1954/55. Generally they were goods or shunting locos, so black anyway, and recieved BR numbers but kept the "Southern" branding rather than "British Railways" or a logo.

Tom

 

To add to the mix there were livery changes between 1923 and 1948 and post nationalisation. For example the GWR changed the garter crest in 1928 and the "shirt button" came in in 1934, during the war freight locos were black and new lettering and insignia came in in 1946. Similar things happened on the LMS and Southern with changes in livery and font style.

Post nationisation the lion and wheel insignia changed in 1956 and the Western went their own way with green being the livery for almost everything apart from freight engines and of, course there was the splendid decision to paint some Duchesses and Princesses red. I think there was only a three year period in their history when all the Duchesses were in the same livery (BR Green)

 

I think some of the GWR liveried locos into the 60s stories aren't because they hadn't been repainted since then, but having talked to someone who seemed to know about these things a while ago, it was known that some western region painters put rather thin coats of paint over the old GWR lettering. After a couple of years it would show through again, and the GWR would live on!

 

I think the Swindon finish was quite durable too, some tank locos survived the war in pre 1934 livery.

 

And later on the Western Region didn't want to paint over GWR liveries with BR ones so left them if they could. Maybe (and this is my speculation) there might have been some surruptitious repainting of engines in GWR livery during BR days?! Who would know if in works a pannier tank (as in the water tank) was separated from its parent loco, found to be needing repainting but then had "GWR" reapplied from old transfers?

 

Shades of Crewe when the Midland Railway took over in 1923! Very few LNWR locos appeared in LMS red livery.