Surviving nineteenth century standard gauge locomotives

Only looking briefly via phone so may have missed it but has Shannon at Didcot been discussed?

 

Yes - in my original list.

Tom

 

It might be useful to separate out locomotives large enough to haul service trains from the little shunters, especially the 0-4-0s and industrials.

If part of the object of the exercise is to inform future policy then including only those large enough to perform traffic duties in the present might be more meaningful.

Perhaps also fair to say that there were fewer major changes in configuration in the small shunters after say 1890 than there were in locomotives for large service trains.

 

Here is a csv list of 138 such locos extracted from the Locomotives Database at http://www.heritage-railways.com/locosdb/locos.php
(I'll admit I cheated as there is no way to generate such a list from the website, so I exported from the behind the scenes database)

Original Company,Loco No,Loco Name,Wheels,Year Built
, ,Puffing Billy,0-4-0,1813
,,Wylam Dilly,0-4-0,1813
, ,Hetton Loco,0-4-0,1822
, ,Killingworth Billy,0-4-0,1826
L&M, ,Rocket,0-2-2,1829
L&M, ,Sans Pareil,0-2-2,1829
,,Agenoria,0-4-0,1829
Cant, ,Invicta,0-4-0,1830
L&M, ,Lion,0-4-2,1838
LNWR,1868 *49,Columbine,2-2-2,1845
S&DR,25,Derwent,0-6-0,1845
FR,3,Coppernob,0-4-0,1846
LNWR,3020,Cornwall,2-2-2,1847
,34 *252, ,0-4-0,1855
,5,Shannon,0-4-0WT,1857
, ,Ellesmere,0-4-0WT,1861
FR,20,,0-4-0,1863
LNWR,*1439 3042, ,0-4-0ST,1865
,5, ,0-4-0ST,1865
FR,25, ,0-4-0ST,1865
Met,23, ,4-4-0T,1866
MR,*158 20002, ,2-4-0,1866
NER,66,Aerolite,2-2-4T,1869
,1,Alderman / Lord Mayor,0-4-0WT,1870
GNR,1, ,4-2-2,1870
, ,Seaham Colliery No 21,0-4-0VB,1870
, ,Coffee Pot,0-4-0VB,1871
LBSC,72 *672 B636 2636 32636,Fenchurch,0-6-0T,1872
, , ,0-4-0GT,1872
LBSC,70 *32670,Poplar Bodiam,0-6-0T,1872
, ,Wellington,0-4-0ST,1873
,17,Coffee Pot,0-4-0VB,1873
,,Bellerophon,0-6-0WT,1874
LSWR,298 3298 *30587, ,2-4-0WT,1874
,2,Bauxite,0-4-0ST,1874
,3, ,0-6-0ST,1874
NER,1275, ,0-6-0,1874
LSWR,314 *30585, ,2-4-0WT,1874
LBSC,55,Stepney,0-6-0T,1875
NER,910, ,2-4-0,1875
LBSC,*662 32662,Martello,0-6-0T,1875
LBSC,*10 32650,Sutton,0-6-0T,1876
GER,229, ,0-4-0ST,1876
LBSC,w8,Freshwater,0-6-0T,1876
,13,Kelton Fell,0-4-0ST,1876
LBSC,*2 110 32110,Cannock Wood / Yarmouth,0-6-0T,1877
,3,Baxter,0-4-0T,1877
,4,Sharpthorn,0-6-0ST,1877
,18, ,0-4-0ST,1877
, ,Minnie,0-6-0ST,1878
,1378 2,Margaret,0-6-0ST,1878
LBSC,W11 *32640,Newport,0-6-0T,1878
, , ,0-4-0ST,1879
, ,Haydock,0-6-0T,1879
LBSC,78 678 2678 *32678,Knowle,0-6-0T,1880
NLR,76 116 2650 7505 *27505 58850, ,0-6-0T,1880
MR,1708 *41708, ,0-6-0T,1880
LBSC,82,Boxhill,0-6-0T,1880
LYR,*752 11456, ,0-6-0ST,1881
,11,Alfred Paget,0-4-0ST,1882
,,Aldwyth,0-6-0ST,1882
LBSC,82 *214,Gladstone,0-4-2,1882
, ,Hodbarrow,0-4-0ST,1882
,5, ,0-6-0PT,1883
, ,Vigilant,0-4-0ST,1883
,3,Enterprise,0-4-0ST,1884
LSWR,*488 30583, ,4-4-2T,1885
Mers,5,Cecil Raikes,0-6-4T,1885
,2,John Bull,0-4-0VB,1885
,15,Sheepbridge No.15,0-6-0ST,1885
NER,1463, ,2-4-0,1885
, , ,0-4-0VB,1886
CR,*123 14010, ,4-2-2,1886
,6,,0-4-0ST,1886
,E1, ,2-4-0CT,1887
LYR,*957 52044, ,0-6-0,1887
, ,City of Aberdeen,0-4-0ST,1887
NBR,*42 9042 68095, ,0-4-0ST,1887
, ,Lindsay,0-6-0ST,1887
,2368, ,0-4-0GT,1888
LNWR,*1054 7799 58926, ,0-6-2T,1888
NER,876 5033 *65033, ,0-6-0,1889
LYR,1008, ,2-4-2T,1889
, ,Toby,0-4-0VB,1890
C&SL,13, ,4wE,1890
, ,Snipey,0-4-0CT,1890
, ,The Welshman,0-6-0ST,1890
, ,Lucy,0-4-0VB,1890
, ,Swanscombe,0-4-0ST,1891
LSWR,24,Calbourne,0-4-4T,1891
NER,1310, ,0-4-0T,1891
, ,Twizell,0-6-0T,1891
NBR,673 *65243,Maude,0-6-0,1891
, ,Sir Berkeley,0-6-0ST,1891
,1, ,0-4-0WT,1892
LNWR,*790 5031,Hardwicke,2-4-0,1892
, ,Lord Mayor,0-4-0ST,1893
LSWR,563, ,4-4-0,1893
LSWR,102 30102,Granville,0-4-0T,1893
NER,1621, ,4-4-0,1893
LSWR,96,Normandy Corrall Queen,0-4-0T,1893
S&MR,1,Gazelle,0-4-2WT,1893
, ,Gladys,0-4-0ST,1894
,61,,0-4-0ST,1894
HR,*103 17916, ,4-6-0,1894
GER,490 62785, ,2-4-0,1894
,4,Oswald,0-4-0ST,1894
, ,Sydenham,0-4-0GT,1895
, ,Dunrobin,0-4-4T,1895
DSB,385, ,0-4-0WT,1895
,35,Rhiwnant,0-6-0ST,1895
SECR,*65 1065 31065, ,0-6-0,1896
,,Bear,0-4-0ST,1896
LYR,1300 12322 *52322, ,0-6-0,1896
,25, ,0-4-0ST,1896
, ,Kinlet,0-6-0ST,1896
, ,Firefly,0-4-0ST,1896
,2,Bon-Accord,0-4-0ST,1897
LSWR,245 30245, ,0-4-4T,1897
GWR,1340,Trojan,0-4-0ST,1897
TVR,*28 450 WD205 67,Gordon,0-6-2T,1897
MR,673, ,4-2-2,1897
GWR,2516, ,0-6-0,1897
LBSC,*473 2473 32473,Birch Grove,0-6-2T,1898
GNR,*990 3990,Henry Oakley,4-4-2,1898
,5 *1338, ,0-4-0ST,1898
,11, ,0-4-0ST,1898
, ,The Lady Armaghdale,0-6-0T,1898
,75S, ,4wE,1898
Met,1 44, ,0-4-4T,1898
,3, ,0-4-0WT,1898
,50,Commander B.,0-4-0ST,1899
, ,Daphne,0-4-0ST,1899
, ,Hawarden,0-4-0ST,1899
GNR,1247 4247 8846 *68846, ,0-6-0ST,1899
TVR,*85 426, ,0-6-2T,1899
CR,828 17566 *57566, ,0-6-0,1899
LSWR,120 *30120, ,4-4-0,1899

 

0-2-2 Count 2
0-4-0 Count 9
0-4-0VB Count 7
0-4-0T Count 45
0-4-2 Count 2
0-4-2T Count 1
0-4-4T Count 4
2-4-0 Count 5
4-4-0 Count 3
4-6-0 Count 1
2-2-2 Count 2
4-2-2 Count 3
4-4-2 Count 1
0-6-0 Count 9
0-6-0T Count 30
0-6-2T Count 4
0-6-4T Count 1
2-2-4T Count 1
2-4-0T Count 3
2-4-2T Count 1
4-4-0T Count 1
4-4-2T Count 1
4wE Count 2
Grand Count 138

Interesting just how many are 4 wheeled tanks. The big gap, I suppose, is the once ubiquitous 2-2-2- passenger locomotive. How ironic that both survivors are ex LNWR, and so is the one current new build of the type.

 

Again not qualifying as 5'3" gauge but almost ignored at Cork Station , this is a National Treasure

 

Anybody have any idea as to which of these machines are currently (end of July 2016) operable?

Paul H

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locomotive_No._1

built for export but representative of a missing type of UK locomotive - apologies if someone has always mentioned this loco

 

When I read the title of the thread, I thought it was going to be another of those tales from the footplate threads

 

It does all rather suggest that the Bloomer replica is rather more important to complete than yet another slight variation on Mr Churchward's theme, or a second P2 (or even a first P2).
And yet... no progress for over a decade. And so substantially begun, too.
From the 19th there are whole design lineages almost unrepresented (e.g. Crewe type).

 

I think the reason for the huge rate of survival of 0-4-0T engines compared to anything else is simple. By the 1870s the basic design of a four coupled shunter was about as far advanced as it was ever going to get, and so they tended to soldier on in industry (either built as industrials, or sold second hand into industry) without ever really being superceded.
Meanwhile the 2-2-2 express locos were almost useless except on fast passenger work - so once bigger more powerful express locos came along, there was nowhere for them to go other than the scrap line.

 

You said standard gauge, 5'3" is Irish standard gauge, I think that counts...

 

I can't find much about this GS&WR No 36 on the internet apart from photos and a reference to GS&WR No 36 being ordered to be photographed by H.A. Ivatt when cut up at Inchicore in 1886, having been withdrawn from service in 1872.

Possibly this photo? http://mikemorant.smugmug.com/keyword/gswr/i-59TFsgW/A

So is the plinthed loco a replica?

 

certainly not. Click on the caption for a little more info

 

Agreed. It underlines the value of Firefly, as a replica. I know it's broad gauge, but as a representative of the type...

 

Ah, needed a PC to view the caption which doesn't appear on my phone. Thanks. Looks like it got a reprieve in the 1880s, I wonder if that was due to Ivatt?

 

I didn't know the bit about attending the 1925 celebrations!

 

The big problem with a single driver is always going to be building one with enough TE to haul a viable commercial load, while still maintaining adhesion. Particularly because those railways that also have an interest in suitable nineteenth century carriages by coincidence tend to have somewhat severe gradients. In addition, there is the problem that most late-Victorian carriages, as typically restored with modern steel underframes, have a tare weight somewhere in the region of 12 tons per carriage, whereas about 7-8 tons per carriage was more typical in the 1850s / 1860s. That makes it hard to pull a viable load with a 25 ton 5-6,000lbf TE single driver locomotive.

A thirty five ton 2-4-0 with, say, 10-12,000lb TE, on the other hand, is a much more viable possibility...

Tom

 

That would make a nice project. Do you have a particular example in mind? Something by Joseph Beattie perhaps?