Cath Ex Victoria to Bath and Bristol - 10/12/16

Times available : -

Out http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U50728/2016/12/10/advanced

Return http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U50732/2016/12/10/advanced

No path back to Southall for the diesel.

Out is via Kenny O. , Reading and Salisbury

Return is via Swindon

 

Still no paths for diesels at either Victoria or Bristol. Drag back to East Depot from P11/12 and then back into P7/8 for departure see below. No further movements to Bristol West Jn and back through station as Tornado did last week.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U50730/2016/12/10/advanced

 

I see from the SD web-site that Braunton is now rostered for this trip, with Royal Scot going to Minehead on Sat 17th instead.

 

I wonder if there is another gauging problem which caused the swap?

 

First post, be gentle!

I was booked on this trip but received a call today to say that Network Rail had told them to drop a carriage, so I am no longer on the trip.

 

Did Steam Dreams say why?

James

 

Just as above, that they'd been told to lose a carriage. I only booked it a couple of weeks ago, so last on first off - fair enough in that respect.

 

Glad to see that the old GWR practice of slip coaches has been revived!

 

They tried that on the Duchess ecs last Saturday but it didn't go down too well.

 

Welcome to the Forum.

The only explanation that I can come up with for this late change is probably down to the loco swap that has happened to this trip.
Originally 46100 Royal Scot was rostered for this excursion. 34046 Braunton is now rostered.
The Royal Scot's (tractive effort 33,150 lbf) are a little bit more powerful than the Bulleid Pacific's (tractive effort 31,000 lbf) and Network Rail are now more strict about train loadings for Steam Locomotives after the review of ML Steam operations which was undertaken due to the serious incidents with West Coast Railway Company Ltd.

 

The change of motive power won't be the reason, the load limits are not set down for the power of individual engines but for a general power classification. Both a light pacific and a Scot are in the same power band and there is more to assessing the power output than tractive effort.
This may help explain the current rules

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/Guidelines-for-steam-train-lengths-and-loads/

Perhaps it's something to do with a shortage of stock after the unfortunate incident at Mitre Bridge.

 

Thanks, I've been a reader for a few years.

I was guessing it may be connected to the loco change, but good to see the facts and figures. I received the tickets six days ago, so it was a very late decision.

 

Thanks for that John.
Could well be a stock problem then or Network Rail don't trust Bulleids as much as Royal Scot's....

Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

 

Network Rail do not set the loadings for steam locomotives - they barely know their own network let alone what load each type of steam loco can haul on it! The loading limits posted above were determined by a consortium of 'industry experts' overseen by NR as the infrastructure owners as steam hauled charter trains aren't their only customers that use it...

It is the TOC that determine the load for a steam charter, as it is the TOC that pays any consequential delays caused by an overloaded train. Unless, of course, NR have to set a length limit due to what the network can physically take (length between signals, loops etc). It is interesting to note that DBC say they will review the merits of each operation and determine their own loads accordingly. Perhaps this is because they are used to running long, heavy freight trains and they feel they do not need to be policed.

 

I think they do set load limits for the leaf fall season, October to December. There was some protest over it this year saying the season was to long.

 

True, I believe NR imposed the duration of the leaf fall season (or rather the duration of perceived risk from adhesion issues caused by leaf fall, which is in line with the industry season norm) but the reduced loadings during this period was still determined by the loadings committee. The whole concept of the resultant loads table was such that any steam locomotive that comes to a stand can restart its load again.

 

No ! Royal Scot needs a little bit of work which can't be completed in time, hence the swap.

 

Thanks for clearing that up! I wonder if it's the reverser as this caused problems at the MHR Autumn Gala?

 

I'm a bit puzzled by the request to drop a coach from this tour since I thought it had been established from various sources (RTT and UK Steam) that there will be an oily diesel chugging away on the back. The load limits stated in the document are for UNASSISTED steam, so I would have thought if the diesel was there it would be permissible to have an extra coach or two. Is this tour now going to be unassisted? I doubt it somehow since letting a Bulleid out at this time of year with a heavy train seems to be considered a risk (Tangmere incident on Martin Mill Bank springs to mind)

 

There are at least 2 other possibilities, already mentioned:
1) a physical limit on the length of the train at some point during the day, e.g. restricted platform or siding length;
2) fewer coaches available to the TOC, following the problems with a coupling earlier in the week - one or more vehicles may be stopped pending inspection.
We sometimes forget that it's not just about the loco and footplate crew...