If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

35028 Clan Line

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Big Al, Mar 2, 2016.

  1. Fred Kerr

    Fred Kerr Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    8,239
    Likes Received:
    5,250
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Freelance photo - journalist
    Location:
    Southport
    It may be a licensing issue if "Golden Arrow" has been registered as a trademark hence its use needing permission from the registered owner. IIRC SNCF holds certain licences hence recent brand changes to VSOE operations; perhaps "Golden Arrow/ Flèche D'Or" is one of those ?
     
  2. Spamcan81

    Spamcan81 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2007
    Messages:
    35,121
    Likes Received:
    20,773
    Occupation:
    Training moles
    Location:
    The back of beyond
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    AFAIK the Bluebell Railway still uses GA regalia on its dining trains so maybe not a trademark issue.
     
  3. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    11,930
    Likes Received:
    10,088
    Occupation:
    Gentleman of leisure, nowadays
    Location:
    Near Leeds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Weren't all these old trademarks, including Pullman, vested in the BRB Residuary, which was abolished in 2013, its intellectual property rights passing to the RSSB? (That IS a question, by the way, I don't know the reality.)
     
  4. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    26,103
    Likes Received:
    57,432
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It does indeed, and has built up a brand for its dining train using the "Golden Arrow" name, so I would be somewhat surprised - given the railway's usual caution over such matters - if there was any issue with copyright.

    Tom
     
  5. huochemi

    huochemi Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    Messages:
    2,751
    Likes Received:
    1,393
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    UK
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    An online search of the Intellectual Property Office register reveals that "The Golden Arrow" trade mark is owned by the Secretary of State for Transport, for Class 39 (transport), as is the "Golden Arrow" device/logo (as used e.g. on the front of locos), but the latter is registered for both Classes 39 and 43 (services for providing food and drink) (and also Pullman).
     
  6. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    11,930
    Likes Received:
    10,088
    Occupation:
    Gentleman of leisure, nowadays
    Location:
    Near Leeds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It's quite possible that the Bluebell have a licence to use it, along with Pullman. BR were quite happy to do such things once they had ceased to use them. It runs in my mind that the station name logo totem design is/was also trademarked at one time.
     
  7. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Clan Line has been known as 'The Golden Arrow engine" for as long as I can remember but I don't think that entitles it to carry the regalia any more than any other loco. However as it is the only heritage loco (I think) to have ever carried it when the train was in service, one could argue that all other examples are just mimicry. :)
     
  8. John Petley

    John Petley Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,849
    Likes Received:
    2,362
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Researcher/writer and composer of classical music
    Location:
    Between LBSCR 221 and LBSCR 227
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Sorry to correct you, Al, but 34092 was a Golden Arrow regular in the 1950s. In one of my old books, I've also got a couple of pictures of Port Line working the GA. Neither 35027 nor 35028 worked it after rebuilding =- the only rebuilt MN so to do was 35015,

    34101 was one of the last trio of Bulleids left at 73A through to 1961 for GA workings and it had studs for the arrows on the side of the smoke deflectors, although I've never actually seen a picture of it working the train.
     
    Martin Perry likes this.
  9. Johnb

    Johnb Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2014
    Messages:
    14,318
    Likes Received:
    16,396
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired, best job I've ever had
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The last steam hauled Arrow was worked by 34100 Appledore. Another loco to carry the regalia in preservation is 34067, an ex Stewart's Lane engine but it never worked the Arrow.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2017
  10. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Happy to be corrected. It's definitely true that any number of unrebuilt Bulleid locomotives carried GA regalia more than anything else. Of course, we must not forget the Britannias and, indeed, the Lord Nelsons although I think the badging came after the Nelsons.
     
  11. brit70000

    brit70000 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    274
    Likes Received:
    30

    34039 Boscastle had the honour of being the regular “Golden Arrow” engine between July and September 1948.
     
    pmh_74 likes this.
  12. derby2

    derby2 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2008
    Messages:
    187
    Likes Received:
    764
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Ran out of jobs
    Location:
    Somerset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    If I can fumble my way through all the 'froth' about Tornado on the S&C this week, another piece of good news is that today Clan Line passed its boiler hydraulic test. A happy Valentine's Day indeed. Next step is the 'in the frames' steam test........
     
  13. mike1522

    mike1522 Long Time Member Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2010
    Messages:
    1,992
    Likes Received:
    232
    Location:
    Fort Worth, Texas
    That is excellent news!!!!
     
  14. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    A link to the latest Clan Line news is below. It includes a view of the middle big end not normally visible:
    https://clan-line.org.uk/news/crewe_19/
     
  15. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    15,330
    Likes Received:
    11,666
    Occupation:
    Nosy aren’t you?
    Location:
    Nowhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Looking good, well done all concerned.
     
  16. Jason Cottage

    Jason Cottage New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2011
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
  17. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    ...and the need for donations and other contributions to keep on coming in remains just as valuable.
     
  18. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    At last Clan Line is starting to look much more like a complete locomotive. After a successful steam test the boiler is now back on the frames. So the reassembly continues.

    Latest information is at: https://clan-line.org.uk/news/crewe_21/
     
    Mick45305 and iancawthorne like this.
  19. aron33

    aron33 Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2016
    Messages:
    437
    Likes Received:
    563
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    United States
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    [​IMG]:Woot:
     
  20. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    21,065
    Likes Received:
    20,775
    Location:
    1016
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Photographs showing the latest stage in the reassembly of Clan Line are now at:
    https://clan-line.org.uk/news/crewe_22/

    I gather that an increase in the flow of donations can be massively motivating for the work rate of the LNWR and MNLPS team so perhaps a final push from anyone who has still not contributed would go down well. But sorry to say that the idea of sponsoring the painting of a boiler band at £500 per band - colour of your choice - has been rejected! :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2017

Share This Page