Question re SWT's 3417

Wasn't she? I wasn't there, so can't really comment, what else did they do with her then?

 

Southern Region EMU electric control of class 73 locomotive at rear.

 

The VEP was hauled dead on the branch, we don't have a juice rail! It was brought in from/ taken back to Bournemouth Depot by Class 73
http://www.swanagerailway.co.uk/news442.htm

 

So what about when it operated with the class 50? Or 66?

The point remains it was still unpowered stock, in the same way a GWR autocoach is hauled stock, if just so happens some locomotives can work with it in a different way to the majority

 

To be honest, im not convinced there is any future for 3rd rail units in preservation except as an exhibit in the NRM or as cheap n' easy loco hauled stock, likely to deteriorate as money goes towards more useful mk1's and vintage stock. I realise there is support for 3rd rail stock, but as the years pass and increasing amounts of money needs to be spent on units only able to be shoved about by diesel, i can only see that drifting away.

I wish this wasnt the case, but you have to be realistic - trying to make 4 coach railtours top and tailed with 73's pay is not going to happen and saying the Bluebell should spend their money on it is unreasonable given their much bigger priorities.

Chris

 

Chris, no offence intended but I do feel that that attitude is very short sighted.
This unit is in as tip top condition as you,ll ever get. Yes its air braked but if a little bit of thought was put into it it could be utilised on a railway to relieve pressure on the "vac" stock.
Could be used for additional services.

Come on guys please dont be blinkered just because its air braked......

Or has it something to do with it having to be diesel hauled? Shock Horror!

 

In that case, give it to someone who is willing to maintain and make use of it....

 

I wonder if it could be hired out to the 3rd rail TOCs for route learning/training...?

I don't think that a VEP is suitable for railtours, but a few ECS runs to other destinations during the year would keep it in good condition and perhaps the maintenance of the unit could be done at a suitable main line depot with a bit of negotiation.

Just being relaistic here, but I don't think the railway has the funds to do anything extra with 3417 other than look after it cosmetically at East Grinstead. What I am suggesting is that a separate group is formed to do additional things with it that keeps it in working condition.

Regards,

Dan

 

Then why send it to the Bluebell in the first place?!

Oh - and when you say "suitable mainline depot" what exactly do you think Wimbledon is? Did you suppose the paintwork and interior is maintained like that by accident? (I'm pulling your leg, Dan - but you see my point)

So lets ask the question I've now asked twice and had no response to:
What about alternative stock? Would the Bluebell consider using other stock at East Grinstead apart from the VEP?

 

:smt001

But would SWT be happy to do this forever? After all the latest franchise renewal requires them to pay the DafT some pretty heavy premium payments. I'm not saying that the people who work in the depot wouldn't look after the unit, I am saying that once it is off SWT's books then it will be viewed differently. By maintenance I mean work to keep the traction motors etc. in serviceable condition, as I imagine that the exterior and interior could be worked on at East Grinstead.

Suitable stock - there are carriages on the Bluebell which might be suitable but I imagine that most of them are still awaiting restoration or are earmarked for shopping in order to maintain the existing carriage sets required to run the service. Mk2 stock might be available although these are hardly in keeping with the railways pre-1968 image and I would imagine that they would cost substantially more than what is being paid for the VEP.

Is anybody that currently looks after 3417 talking directly to the Bluebell Railway Plc. regarding the units future prospects? We can sit here and type away merrily but only by talking to the future owners can action be taken...

Regards,

Dan

 

Is there any alternative stock though?

 

There could be - it rather depends on a few things:

Firstly, is the Bluebell wedded to the idea of having a four coach train standing at East Grinstead, or could, perhaps, other items of redundant coaching stock fulfill the same role?

Secondly, would the Bluebell support the idea of having the VEP preserved for uses other than scrote target practice?

Thirdly, do any members of the Bluebell management board read this forum?

If so, I think we ought to arrange a meeting.

I am, by the way, absolutely genuine about this.

 

Not as far as I'm aware, you'd probably be better off contacting the railway direct if you have any serious proposals for them

 

It needs to be in excellent condition - the bluebell cant use their own stock as its needed for trains, so it has to look elsewhere. It just happens there is a VEP in good condition with no future prospects and hey presto; a common sense, realistic use of a unit which would otherwise be doing nothing and can be secured at little cost. Im afraid it comes across to me that its being treated as a toy (being paid for out of other people's pockets) thats being taken away. If people want it they should buy it from the bluebell; the cost should be enough to restore another coach that can be used on the line when its finished, and im sure the railway would be receptive if you got in touch, you only have to phone them or drop them an email.

Chris

 

That's alright then, the Bluebell Railway will sell it for what they paid for it. (£1 I believe)

 

Ah, but SWT wanted to get rid of it, Bluebell don't

 

I'm afraid I agree, that is how it comes accross (whether thats the intended tone or not). There is no reasonable future for the unit in terms of use on the Third Rail, and I believe SWT have committed to get rid of it as part of their franchise agreement or something, sure someone will clear clear that up is not the case but I seem to remember reading about it in several sources, including the Southern Electric Group IIRC which has no vested interest at all as far as I can tell.

Other lines had the opportunity to put an offer in for it (how long after the end of SWT slammers did it sit around at Bournemouth and then Wimbledon without anyone buying it?), it's not the fault of the Bluebell they didn't do so. And the fact remains when it's use is finished at Bluebell, it's not going to be cut-up or anything like that, there is no reason why it can't then be taken for what it would ultimately become anyway if Bluebell didn't buy it, hauled coaching stock, then.

If, Keelar, you believe you can find a suitable way of funding the unit running on the mainline privately (as that is the only way it will continue running on third rail, a preserved 3rd rail line seems a very distant dream) then fine, get in contact with the Bluebell and buy the unit. But if not then whats the point? It seems from your posts here and on your website that you enjoy using it as a shunter. Fine, but you wouldn't be able to use it as such if you bought it privately I'm sure (even if you hired it out how would you cover mounting maintainence costs?). And at the end of the day how often does it run outside of the confines of Wimbledon depot?

Sitting at East Grinstead it could come in for abuse by these supposed local scrotes (which in all the time I have spent there I have never seen any evidence of), but could you say with any certainty it would not be at the same risk in Swanage? Or Alton? Or even Wimbledon?

 

Forgive me for this, but I am sure I read somewhere that the Bluebell were getting some free infastructure work done at E.G. station site for taking the VEP?,once they had this work done , one feels that interest would be lost in this unit.

regards

 

I'm not so sure, I can't see anyone being happy about having a unit in disrepair as the lines public face. True it wouldn't be the top of the lines priorities but somehow I can't see it being neglected when it would be a symbol of the line as it were.

 

MK1 units attract vandals/"artists" like flies to ... . I can see the VEP being repainted/bricked (at best) or torched (at worst) before the month is out. Still, it should fetch a tidy sum with today's scrap prices.

Can't see why a line that prides itself on being all-steam, with a superb fleet of pre-grouping/nationalisation coaches, would take on a BR MK1 electric unit as their public face at EG. It would make sense at somewhere like the East Kent, where such stock makes up the majority of their running fleet, but not here. The "free infrastructure work" would certainly make things clearer.