1014 County of Glamorgan

LMS 8Fs and Class 5s steamed very well with a similar boiler to the rebuilt County pressed to 225psi. If 1014 is eventually completed and proves a robust performer, all the negative comments about the boiler will hopefully be history.

If the GWS were to get the smokebox rolled, cast a smokebox door, make outside stream pipe covers and assemble it topped off with that beautiful condition double chimney that they have been given, the "face" of a double chimney County would be seen for the first time in well over 50 years. With good publicity, ( maybe a cover photo on Steam Railway magazine?) this could give the project a big boost and hopefully increase the funding.

 

From when I used to visit a lot as a child, I don't recall them having the branch and thus one locomotive would do for the 'main' line, although there were often two, also when I look back to what was going on during those visits, I do wonder whether modern insurance requirements have led to a substantial reduction to what they can actually do on the site now.

Didn't 4144 fail not long after her completion which also ties in with the need to hire as an unforeseen occurance?

 

I doubt it, moaners still moan after the event.

 

when I were a lad there would be several in steam for the September open day.

 

The design rationale for the County, insofar as it can be understood, was to produce a loco with comparable power to a Castle using the same cylinders as the Saints, 2800s etc. That required a slightly bigger boiler, to provide enough power, and a considerably higher boiler pressure, to provide the required TE.

Subsequently reducing the boiler pressure to 250 psi would have reduced the TE in proportion but reduced the power somewhat less, because the same amount of heat from the tubes can deliver more pounds of steam at lower pressure. Working at a correspondingly later cut-off to restore the same TE at any given speed means slightly lower cylinder efficiency, but not a big difference. A further reduction, in the new-build County, to 225 psi will mean a further small reduction in available power and a further significant reduction in maximum TE.

For preserved line use it will make little or no difference. If they (a) decide they still wish to run it on the main line and (b) manage to do so, the reduced pressure will result in the loco still a tad more powerful than a Hall but somewhat less powerful than the original Counties. Will that be a real County? That is more of a philosophical question than an engineering one; but I still wish they were having a completely new 280 psi boiler built.

 

Just to clear up any misconceptions, two engines in steam has been the norm during the high season for many years; during quieter periods one engine is used. The diesel railcar only saw sporadic use in the past, but has become much more frequent in the last 3-4 years. (A good thing IMO!) The branch has been in use since the early 1980's, however until the recent relaying was not passed for taking 4144. Ideally there needs to be at least two operational engines capable of being used on the branch. The GWS has the choice of: 93, 3738, 1363, 1340, 5572, 1466, Bonnie Prince Charlie, 3650 and 1338 - the last two being privately owned.

Whilst 1014 will benefit from a larger grate area than a Modified Hall, in the real world I'm not sure how the engine would be any more powerful, as the bottom ends of the two classes are identical, save for the fractionally larger wheels on 1014. Incidentally, the original Counties had increased valve lap & travel over the Halls, although again the difference was only fractional.

 

Well it seemed the County was being worked on today when I popped in to Didcot today so looks like they aren't perturbed by this boiler chat, and 3650 was being very quickly dismantled with a definite sense of urgency. In fact the works looked very busy with a Hunslet getting a Thomas make over and I think the Saint loitering in one of the few bits of the place you couldn't see into, as well as Trojan apparently off site and 1363 in bits, and the 72xx coming along and the 56xx having a repaint I think. All very impressive. Only thing I found odd was Pendennis Castle sat in the engine shed which apparently needs more work to get done including taking the boiler out again. Surely with a loco so near completion it would make sense to slow other projects to get her done? Unless they don't want to have so many big engines pulling two coaches, with the Saint and probably the King up and running soon, having another loco that requires half a ton of coal just to cover the grate might not be optimum.

 

The boiler of no. 1014 arrives at Heritage Boiler Steam Services new facilities. https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=2194408617549486&id=1988973648092985&__xts__[0]=68.ARCgdCvWTZrwayVxUMxUi0_1unpkMhMzrwhCaShUJf-mcgDuGnR7-S_CBTTwSrtTNBaUwpnWAAqLqioPkBqoSFNFr8X0miZLCIoWvMc1FLoU5cEg90GdVFeae4-OcInuTMF5GETGGPcrMMobT8A6g7tz63-oE3Z0PMYjxFkafAHbZVvmr9-2ng&__tn__=-UC-R

They certainly not lie about these guys! Very impressed and a very delightful start for their new boiler business. A very vital contributionto the preservation of operational steam locomotives.
The orders seems to roll inn, so maybe the staff needs to be increased soon.. (I would loved to join them if I had their skills)

Wish them all the best further!

Knut

 

Do we know if they have taken on apprentices ?

 

According to the 72xx at Buckinghamshire railway centers Facebook page their boiler is also going to HBSS

 

Indeed the last Three black 5's with double chimneys ( Stephensons x 1, Caprotti x 2) we're considered a step above the others in some respects

Regardless of the shortcomings of a boiler running at 90% BR /80% of original pressure, the ability of this detuned county ; with more umph than a Hall and a higher permitted speed, could still prove to be useful on the mainline, but then the original height GWR chimney and the huge cylinders width shoot it in the foot for that.

 

Sorry to disagree but, if by more "umph" you mean tractive effort, it'll actually have less as the driving wheels are 3" larger with the same boiler pressure, cylinder dia & stroke. The whole reason Hawksworth designed the Counties with 280psi boiler pressure was to get as high a T.E. as possible from 2 cylinders. As regards the chimney I've always understood that a reduced height chimney, cab and safety valves were planned. The cylinders are the originals from Willingdon Hall so are no more "huge" than those on any of the other Halls currently on the main line. The chaps (and chappesses) at Didcot have have put a lot into this project and I take my hat off to them for that but I can't help feeling that, in the end, this will just be a weak pastiche of a County.
Ray.

 

What's been kept from the Barry Ten is the frames (but modified), the cylinders, some of the motion and part of the firebox. The rest of the firebox, the boiler barrel, the tubes, the wheels and most of the umpteen small bits are new. So my guesstimate would be that about three-quarters of the final loco will be new metal. How much more would it have cost to build 100% new?

 

..... and we wouldn't have lost a perfectly restorable Hall and 8F in the process.
Ray.

 

Wholeheartedly agree but that topic has been discussed to death. It is just a sad fact that the same resourcefulness, energy, determination and endeavour going into the "new builds" wasn't given to the donors.

 

Happy to be corrected Marshall5, had it in mind that the cylinders we're 20 inchers for some reason...

 

To describe anything from the Barry Ten as being perfectly restorable seems a bit of a stretch. With so much missing or rotted beyond salvation would there really have been much more than 25% original if anyone had been prepared to restore one ?

 

Lets not go through this again, suffice to say that any of the ten were as viable to restore as recreating a "missing" type from their parts. The only difference was motivation in that there was obviously more enthusiasm to build a 47xx than restore an 8F, for example. Unfathomable to me but each their own.

 

If anything at all was to be done with the Barry Ten other than scrapping, someone had to be willing to do it. There were groups willing to use a lot of the parts to reconstitute some missing classes of loco, so that is what is happening. Opinions clearly differ as to whether any particular one of these builds is better or worse use of the parts than restoring the original locos.

To my mind the County is about the weakest case, both because as things have turned out it is using so little material from the Barry Ten and because, with the reduced boiler pressure, it won't be a real County; unlike for example the Grange, which likewise has a large proportion of new parts but will be a real Grange.

However the County is fulfilling an undertaking to the Council that was the custodian of the Barry Ten. Let's hope that, when finished, it does pull some trains, if only at Didcot and on some preserved railways.

 

It seems incredibly sad that the 10 wobegone hulks survived against the odds only for several to be destroyed at a point in time when restoration became technically more feasible than ever. Equally the production of brand new replicas is more viable than ever, both engineering wise and economically. Hindsight of course, but not 'preservation's finest moment.