The Flying Scotsman Christmas Dalesman 22/12/18

Couldn't find a thread for this. There have been some times up on RTT for several days, someone more adept than me will probably provide the links, but looking at them this is what appears to be happening . . .

ECS is diesel hauled from Carnforth to Brewery Jn loop
FS comes from ELR and attaches to front
Diesel returns LE to Carnforth
FS hauls train from Man Vic via S&C to Carlisle (ECS remains in pl 1)
FS turned and serviced and returns train via WCML
At Carnforth FS comes off and diesel comes on
Diesel returns train to Man Vic
ECS continues to Brewery Jn loop and diesel runs round.
ECS returns via Blackburn and is stabled overnight at Hellifield loop before returning to Carnforth on Sunday.

Probably, I think! I'm on it, coach G / 1b from Bolton for anyone who might want to say hello.

 

Fairly long stop at Appleby... 54 minutes. Is something happening?! There won't be any ice cream left...

 

Just as long as there is one for me!

 

Outward and back workings below.


http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U10562/2018/12/22/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U10564/2018/12/22/advanced

 

Cows started going on strike then as in refusing to go in for milking. I doubt they will stop offering it for people at Appleby when there are steam tours going down the S&C in either direction as it brings in money for them and it keeps the passengers aswell as the footplate crews happy and even when im on tours over the S&C, I aswell as my mates are willing to pay a couple of quid for one as it keeps me and my mates happy during the stops at Appleby. Especialy if it's a warm day.

 

60103 through to Man Vic, then ELR

 

No, off at Carnforth.

JS

 

According to west coast railways acting as ticket booking agents rolling stock providers I.R.R.T. are running another ciitadel on 13th april 2019 with 45157 and 45212 BUT only steam from man vic outward and return as far as carnforth so it says on west coasts website probably the 5,s cud b doing the jacobite afterwards so its put me off booking to go on this tour wi steam only doin 3 quarters o the tour. Davo 56f

 

But at two-thirds of the price of the November run, in the daylight throughout. £79 for a double headed run over Hoghton, Ais Gill and Shap strikes me as good value for money.

 

West Coast Railways are really putting on some very atractive priced trips of late, £30 for their Santas over Shap 2 ways with BIL & now Double headed Black fives over the S & C then Shap for £79 - Excellent.
I hope the other Promotors are taking note ? I really worry about the costing on the 2019 RTC Blackpool trips for the steam mileage offered ? Would be so much more attractive if the steam came on at Crew ?

 

I can not comment on the economics of running a railtour but if you compare a WCRC Christmas trip with a London originating CME/CCE etc then it is bound to be cheaper.
A London CME has
Hotel costs for Friday night
ECS move from Southall (by diesel) on the Saturday morning (and stabling fee at Euston for the diesel?)
ECS move of Class 86 "Les Ross" from Rugby early hours Saturday morning
Hire of Les Ross
Network access and station costs which I assume are mileage based and number of station call based and hence greater
3 Guards, one Southall-Euston-Carnforth, another Carnforth-Carlisle-Farrington Junction, the other Farrington Junction-Euston
At least 2 drivers for Les Ross
Normally 2 (but sometimes 1 steam driver)
Stock normally overnights at Euston and on Sunday ECS to Southall if lucky, but normally Acton Lane Reception Sidings. Then Monday back to Southall. That all builds up crew needs, plus hotel accommodation costs in Central London on one of the most expensive nights of the week.

The Santa trip I am not familiar with but I guess one steam driver, one diesel driver and a guard and all contained within (by railtour standards) a short day. Plus being an in-house operation WCRC may choose to absorb some costs themselves from a PR perspective.

 

Agree. The Brief Encounter trip round the Hellifield circle was £50 with only standard class (13 full coaches) for a one crew job. I could believe that was around break even.

 

Sure. And the rake included some first class coaches--- I don't think they had twelve standard coaches available at Carnforth at the time. From memory the steward said there were 560 on board which sounds plausible.

 

A couple of years ago RTCs Cumbrian Mountain Express,ran from London with Les Ross,and the fare was £69. Now the fare is £109! What justifies such a huge increase? I say good on West Coast for keeping fares down.

 

Access charges and rolling stock hire would be the main elements.

 

Will stocks last...