If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. brennan

    brennan Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2016
    Messages:
    242
    Likes Received:
    294
    Location:
    Gloucester
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Candidates should preferably live within 40 miles, or one hour’s journey time.......

    So, if I live in Bristol I needn't bother to apply. What if I live in Plymouth? Presumably no chance at all? Is this further evidence of the inward-thinking in this part of Somerset? What a silly thing to put in an advert for volunteer staff, yes VOLUNTEERS ie people that you want to come and do the job for nothing so you can keep your railway running.
     
    D8568, Yorkshireman and michaelh like this.
  2. Beckford

    Beckford Guest

    On the other hand: it does say "should" and not "must" and the word "preferably" infers discretion, surely?
     
  3. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    25,493
    Likes Received:
    23,733
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    In that position, it might well deter me, even with that wording. If I'm stepping forward to try to join (as opposed to being asked to do something), I'm taking a risk. What if I don't like it/am no good at the job/don't get on with people/can't offer the level of commitment that's really needed? Long ago I was taught that if someone doesn't get what I'm trying to say, it is never their fault - but always mine for not communicating effectively enough with them, however stupid/contrary/whatever they are. This exchange with @Forestpines effectively demonstrates the principle, and the goodwill that can be lost.

    So rephrasing as "We are particularly keen to recruit volunteers from within 1 hour's drive because..." could achieve the same end without the deterrent effect to those from further afield.

    I am also quite sure that the effect can be found in many places, and is by no means unique to West Somerset.
     
    D8568, Bean-counter, horace and 5 others like this.
  4. Greenway

    Greenway Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2008
    Messages:
    3,906
    Likes Received:
    3,704
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    South Hams
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I get the impression that not only are WSRA Membership numbers apparently down, presumably, from the list of volunteer post requirements previously mentioned, the numbers volunteering have fallen. Given the number of people posting here, mostly of good calibre and probably a great asset to the line and that maybe only the tip of the iceberg, that have had unpleasantness with the railway it is no wonder some people are reluctant to volunteer and look elsewhere.
     
  5. Maunsell907

    Maunsell907 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2013
    Messages:
    881
    Likes Received:
    1,965
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Peter, my understanding is that the PLC Board by various measures ( recounted often by the PLC Chair )
    enabled the Railway to keep operating through this current (2019 ) season. In other words what we ( I
    refer to the large body that, supports, volunteers and offers financial assistance to our great Railway )
    all hope will be a satisfactory 2019 trading Season.

    May I suggest that prognostications of doom, in addition to the recent public washing of dirty linen on
    this site, are not a helpful sales pitch.

    The reality is we have an operating Railway. Trip advisor contributions have invariably highlighted
    our friendly welcoming staff. They are our strength, let us not undermine them.

    Michael Rowe
     
    Barrie the Beer, CH 19, MattA and 8 others like this.
  6. Andy Norman

    Andy Norman Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2015
    Messages:
    737
    Likes Received:
    4,393
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    West Somerset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Michael

    I partly agree with you, however brushing it all under the carpet and refusing to talk about the way people are welcoming and treating volunteers (I was that happy friendly staff on the footplate welcoming our customers, remember) does not change the facts that volunteer numbers are reducing and WSRA membership is falling, it has been for 5 years now and the way volunteers are dealt with is getting worst if you don’t agree with the new PLC leaders (I only illustrate my experiences for example, there are many others, trust me, most just slip quietly into the background). Brushing it all under the carpet and saying all is well is why the WSR is where it is, perhaps time to try something different.

    This latest conversation started with Fundraising. The WSRA was tasked with fundraising and looking after and attracting volunteers, yet it has been confirmed in this thread that they are still four years later talking about what the time scales to implement the Coombes Review will be, it hasn’t started yet (it’s not totally the WSRA’s fault however).

    The WSR has paid and volunteer leaders on both sides who have been in post during this period from the EX6 until now and still nothing changes. The fundraising is not happening and I now hear that the Dunster Goods Yard Project has been scrapped.

    I understand that the PLC needs to make some changes and some may not be pleasant but the recovery plan and overdraft to carry the WSR through into 2019 was put in place by the previous now departed FD so it was safe and expected nothing was a surprise, the overdraft was also in place the year before it had just grown some in 2018 (public record figures so I’m not saying anything not already know).

    But what happens next. I started this with the saying “If you always do what you have always done you will always get what you have always got”. As others close to the action have also said “there is funding out there for the right projects with the right management”, do you honestly think that an open railway and good trip advisor results will get an additional £1 million a year, when actually the grand reopening at Easter this year attracted less people than Easter 2018 ?

    All I’m saying is own the problem, talk it through in the open, work with others (there are many great ideas from people on this forum who I’ve learned a lot from in their posts), do something about it or allow others to do it instead. Please don’t keep the PR to all saying it’s all going to be ok, it’s not . Unless you double the passenger numbers by next week for the rest of the year or get fundraising in large volumes now it’s not looking good.

    I do agree with you however that staff/volunteers are the strength not to be undermined, you are right the WSRA needs to focus on Volunteers and Fundraising and the PLC needs to let them do it.
     
    michaelh, ghost, Herald and 7 others like this.
  7. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    Messages:
    6,078
    Likes Received:
    4,893
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Swanage
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I would personally read that as "we do not want you if you are more than an hour away but are not allowed to say that". It is the sort of thing we put in job adverts at the company I worked in as we expected people to work far longer than their contracted hours and thus not be constrained by travel time.
     
    D8568, michaelh, Yorkshireman and 2 others like this.
  8. 45076

    45076 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2011
    Messages:
    478
    Likes Received:
    313
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    34004
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
  9. Beckford

    Beckford Guest

    On the other hand: "Questions to Consider" says this:

    "11) How far is my journey to my preferred work area? Do my travel time and work area location mean an over onerous journey time? The Railway does not give any travelling expenses."

    The context is important, I suggest.
     
    Bluenosejohn likes this.
  10. 35B

    35B Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
    Messages:
    25,493
    Likes Received:
    23,733
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Grantham
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Which in light of my previous post is a really good point, well made.
     
  11. Maunsell907

    Maunsell907 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2013
    Messages:
    881
    Likes Received:
    1,965
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    For the record. Your statements wrt the overdraft and specifically " expected nothing was a surprise"
    are absolutely wrong. I am afraid you have been in the past guilty of misleading statements. I remember in the past
    you questioned why the Plc had not invested its 'cash' despite P&L statements that showed cash
    reserves declining seriously .

    I have never made any such statement wrt volunteer recruitment as "the PLC needs to let them (WSRA)
    do it" not least because we volunteers are Plc staff. Volunteer recruitment needs, who ever fronts it,
    to involve the Plc. They are after all de facto, the employer.

    Andy, I appreciate you feel very upset. However your postings vacillate between airing your grievances
    and extolling how good your fellow volunteers were. Whilst you are receiving support from other
    contributors on this site ( in one of your postings you referred to the number of likes you are
    obtaining) I cannot see how these postings assist your relationship with either the PLC or the
    WSRA. For sure they do not benefit the greater WSR.

    Michael Rowe
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  12. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    11,930
    Likes Received:
    10,088
    Occupation:
    Gentleman of leisure, nowadays
    Location:
    Near Leeds
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    In my book, it's either a requirement or it isn't. You can't put it in as a requirement, even if it says 'should' and then say that we don't really mean it. If that is the case, take it out. The NYMR has volunteers doing safety critical work from many distant places, including Holland. Unsurprisingly, they don't travel home between turns of duty; they stay in the vicinity and usually do several days at a time. In my experience, this is a quite common situation on heritage railways.
     
    D8568, tracker, michaelh and 12 others like this.
  13. Andy Norman

    Andy Norman Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2015
    Messages:
    737
    Likes Received:
    4,393
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    West Somerset
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Michael

    I’m always very careful to be able to support anything I say with facts.

    Regarding the finances, during late 2018 I was heavily involved with both the previous FD and the HPC Due Diligence process where HPC’s auditors closely looked at the financial situation of the WSR prior to the final award of the grant from them. You would not expect somebody like HPC to hand over £96k without a thorough check of both the PLC & WSRA Accounts going back three years and both organisations rightly gave HPC full, honest and open access to ensure the sustainability of the WSR over the HPC Community Project lifespan. Both the previous FD and I attended meetings and discussed the situation at length with all parties. I can assure you I’m not mistaken.

    For the record HPC’s partner and auditors were happy to proceed with giving the grant. There were no conditions set regarding the finances or financial issues by them, there were however a number set regarding the governance of the PLC as there were concerns, this area absorbed much time which the current leadership of the WSRA will confirm. A number of actions, re-assurances and notification requirements put in place regarding governance and changing in governance going forward, both the PLC & WSRA made written undertakings. For example the leaving of your close friend from the PLC board this week requires a notification to be sent to the relevant person controlling the grant, the continuing award and future payments relies on it (Mike: I trust you have done this).

    I’m happy to go into a lot more detail if you need proof, but maybe to take your point it would be better to keep that washing in the washing machine !!!

    As for my relationship with the PLC & WSRA , both have made their position on that very clear to me, there is not one for me to be concerned about, I am however concerned about the WSR, its people and its future.
     
    michaelh, Herald, Greenway and 4 others like this.
  14. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    26,103
    Likes Received:
    57,432
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Indeed, far from uncommon. One might note in passing that by her own posts, @Robin Moira White volunteers not only on the WSR, but also as a signalman at Swanage (about 2.5 hours from Stogumber) and as a director on the KESR (about 4.5 hours from Stogumber, depending on what mood the M25 might be in), presumably without the distance being considered by those railways a significant hinderance to her ability to fulfil either role.

    Tom
     
    tracker, michaelh, Herald and 6 others like this.
  15. echap

    echap New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2009
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    396
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Church Volunteer
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I was unsure whether to post this but I feel that I should. In light of the many comments being made on here, particularly about the Plc and its directing volunteers, I am troubled that one position seems to be central to so much of what has happened but I have not seen any sign of recognition of possible fault. The General Manager is the most senior paid staff member but apparently was not responsible for any of the failings identified by the ORR. Instead 3 Heads of Departments were sacked. The GM has also sat on the Plc Board for many years whilst nearly/all the other board members have changed. I am a little curious as to why this person appears to not to have had to take any responsibility for the problems that have appeared over the past few years. Obviously I am not party to discussions but I am a little troubled that the same person is still in their role, especially as the new Chairman is making it clear that the Plc is to be trusted to get everything right from now on. This is not meant to be personal but just something that has repeatedly worried me. I think that what Andy Norman has said has also made me wonder a bit more.

    Edit: I meant to add that I will be visiting the railway again this year and spending money to help the railway.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  16. Snifter

    Snifter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,628
    Likes Received:
    4,210
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I have had discussions on this very subject with the last 4 chairmen, one current board member (although I have not looked at Companies House today) and one former FD so I'm struggling to understand why you think the current situation was not foreseen.
     
    michaelh, Herald and Bean-counter like this.
  17. Maunsell907

    Maunsell907 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2013
    Messages:
    881
    Likes Received:
    1,965
    Gender:
    Male
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Yes of course; many of us recognised over the previous four years the erosion of cash reserves and commented
    accordingly

    However the statement made by the then FD at the November 'Oake' meeting and the subsequent
    reports indicate that his reassurance that there were sufficient funds to 'see the Company' through
    the 'winter shut' was at the best optimistic.

    This is not I think a subject we should pursue, merely to note that Mr Norman was incorrect.

    Michael Rowe

    ps We must thank the current Plc Board for obtaining the requisite financial assistance to
    ensure our continuing operation. There is much to be done.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  18. 61624

    61624 Part of the furniture

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,294
    Likes Received:
    3,596
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The problem as I see it is that the WSR was rescued this winter by asset sales (41XX) and an overdraft. We know that the railway needs to spend at least as much again this winter and for many years to come. Perhaps it will come from better trading figures this year but if it doesn't then what? Is it realistic to expect passenger numbers to recover by 10% in a year, which is probably what it needs - what has changed to cause that? If there is a shortfall, will the railway have to sell another loco? Would the bankers entertain a further increase in overdraft? Grant money is not the answer in the short term as applications take a lot of time and work to prepare (The NYMR's forthcoming HLF decision took around 3-4 years for the application to be worked up) and grant awarding bodies take their time. It is also necessary to meet their criteria, which is often the hardest part of the process. Nor is it realistic to expect the shareholders to bail the railway out every year - and whilst they contributed this year I don't believe the sum raised was that great - again, putting this into context, the NYMR has to raise around £2.5M in matched funding if its HLF application is successful, so even being awarded a grant brings headaches with it! Unless something miraculous happens (not impossible, a big legacy is always a possibility)I fear the WSR may struggle to survive for years to come.
     
    michaelh, ghost, Herald and 5 others like this.
  19. HY_4273

    HY_4273 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2009
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    48
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Editor
    Location:
    The Eastern and Western Regions
  20. granmaree

    granmaree Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2015
    Messages:
    541
    Likes Received:
    497
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer

Share This Page