FR & WHR & WHHR News

R.S.Thomas lived in Criccieth if you wanted a poet with a local connection.

 

How about an England painted pink and named "Harold Wilson"? History repeating itself ....

Palmerston in Glan-y-Mor yard sometime after repainting, as a joke, in 1965. By the time of the photo (from Ffestipedia) someone had removed the rubber "Harold Wison" nameplates.
Ray.

 

That photo represents the condition in which I first saw Palmerston, back in 1972 ..... and why, the first time I saw a photo of the restored loco in steam, out on The Cob, I honestly thought Prince had been temporarily assigned it's sibling's identity for a photoshoot. The realisation it really was a resurrected No.4 really was one hell of a pleasant surprise.

Roll on Welsh Pony!

 

With Welsh Pony joining the fleet soon, will it mean that 'there will allways be an England' at the Ffes in steam?..................I'll just get my coat on the way out if thats ok

 

It would certainly work, if potentially a loaded with political symbolism

An earlier meeting of DLG and WW.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Four_(World_War_I)#/media/File:Big_four.jpg


I have no idea if there was ever a loco named after Clemenceau or Orlando.

 

Can't argue with that!

 

I would have thought that the fact railway exists in the state it is now is a bigger tribute to the efforts of people like Alan Pegler than the cheesy naming of an engine after him.

Anyway on the second point it would make more sense to paint JS green. It is a copy of the as built Merddin and this was green when first built so the livery would fit the loco. Taliesin was actually painted in full GNR livery from delivery until the late 1880s. Early design sketches even show it with a Sterling style cab.

Tim

 

I don't take much interest in the naming of locos, and I don't think Alan Pegler took that much interest arguably in the Ffestiniog, and in any event as I understand it, and and I am happy to be corrected, his Dad stumped up the money to buy out the Davies' controlling shareholding.

'Ninian Davies' might be a more appropriate name for a new FR loco. The Snowdon Railway already has a loco called 'Ninian' named after him. I would suggest Ninian Davies was really the person who allowed the Ffestiniog Railway to be saved.

But I am quite happy with the new Double Fairlee being called 'James Spooner', and as befits a very well run preserved railway, they are making excellent progress with this 'new build'.

Cheers,

Julian

 

In regards to the 'great name debate' would it not be out of order to place the word 'The' infront of Mountaineer on one of the loco's, making it 'The Mountaineer'??? there is a sort of historical context as 'Princess' was origionally 'The Princess'.
Just a thought.......

 

As I recall, some people already (used to?) add a 'the' in front of the name of the loco. Hence people talk about 'the Blanche', 'the David Lloyd George', so you'd end up with 'the Mountaineer' and 'the The Mountaineer'. (Which might be confused for a B side by a 1980s band).

But discussions about the name and the colour can end up being a bit bald men fighting over a comb.

 

Yeah, but what style of comb? Teeth the whole length, or half length with handle? And if full length, all one thickness and pitch, or separate coarse and fine sections at each end?

Tom (Member number 1, and indeed sole member, of the UK comb spotting society) ..

 

It is quite dull naming engines after people using their full names anyway. Just first names or nicknames give them a bit more personality rather than being rolling birth certificates. "Livingston Thompson" is an incredibly boring name, it's no wonder it got changed to Taliesin. Would Linda be as popular if it was called "Linda Blanche Douglas-Pennant"?

At least nobody has suggested naming an engine "Volunteer" yet.

Tim

 

You seem to have forgotten about the most important aspect of all, what colour is the comb!

 

Am I the only one who thinks the preservation era FfR has been rather more imaginative naming their diesel fleet? The Baldwin's highly appropriate moniker, Moelwyn, has always tickled me.

 

What you mean full names like David Lloyd George? Yeah, it'll never catch on. Soooooo boorrring.

I am assuming that the Comb Museum in Switzerland, much like Veterans Stadium in Philadelphia, has its own prison cells due to all the fights breaking out.

 

I never suggested that the railway doesn't still use boring names. How many people actually call it David Lloyd George anyway? At best it gets called "Soup Dragon". Same goes for Earl of Merioneth.

"The Princess" thankfully wasn't called "Princess Alexandra of Denmark". "Lord Palmerston" is a bit stuffy but "Palmerston" suits the loco quite well and doesn't immediately remind you that it was a blatant attempt to schmooze the Prime Minister at the time.

Less is more if you ask me, which nobody did We're in the entertainment business and I think it is better if there is a bit of story to engage people when they ask about the name. My personal favourite is that Taliesin also means "fair pay" or "reward" and the story goes that William Williams convinced the board to name it after the bard. However there was a pay dispute at the time. So the staff took great delight in riding around on an engine with "fair pay" written on the side in a brass plaque.

Tim

 

Taliesin comes from 'tâl' + 'iesin' usually translated as 'shining brow'. 'Brow' as in 'brow of a hill' etc is often found in placenames (e.g. Talyllyn, etc). The word 'tâl' does also mean the noun 'pay' (the verb 'to pay' being 'talu'). If you're lucky enough to see a sign saying 'Parcio di-dâl', that means you don't have to pay for parking! By extension, 'iesin' can mean a range of things such as mystical, or fair, but really 'fair' in the sense of attractive rather than equality. So, the staff at the time were indulging in some amusing word-games by deriving 'fair pay' from 'shining brow'!!

To get back on topic, my tuppence worth on the name: make it changeable, anyone can get their name or the name of a loved one on the engine for 6 months at a time for a grand (or one one side only for 500 quid)!!

 

You can have the comb if you want it. but Penrhyn naming convention was never consistent after all, it was George Sholto and Hugh Napier not George and Hugh, and Linda and Blanche but not Linda Blanche and Blanche Georgina.

I recognise some faces there (at least one person I am still in contact with). I do have some memories of that week. I seem to recall that DLG had only just been commissioned and was black and might not have had a cab. As I recall, I think someone from Boston Lodge was killed in a car accident during the week. But it was a long time ago so it maybe that memories of different trips have merged together.

 

That is interesting re. Taliesin. All the same though...much as I love GNR green, I would also been keen to see a Fairlie in the later FfR green with red and black lining. If ME or DLG were repainted thus, they would be almost the spitting image of the first Earl of Merioneth in the late '50s/60s...now wouldn't that be a wonderful sight to see again?

 

Yes, it would.