60007 (4498) Sir Nigel Gresley Overhaul

Thank the lord they didn't name one Swallow otherwise we would have a debate about whether it was an African or European one?

Still makes my head hurt the numbering sequence of the A4's. I always assumed that SNG was alater example than Mallard based on numbering.

 

Wild swan is generally held to be an alternative name for Whooper swan (Cygnus cygnus), a winter vistor from the Arctic.

The term seems to have fallen from use in recent years.

 

Which 'European' one? Barn swallow, or Red-rumped swallow? I've seen them both in England.

 

and both spent their winter in Africa. No such species as an African Swallow btw although plenty of hirundines in Africa we wouldn't see in Britain.

 

Its a Monty Python reference.....

 

If railways can name their locomotives after all sorts of people and things, including mythological characters, what's wrong with a name such as "seagull", which we all understand perfectly well and many of us use, even if some of us complain that it's not a proper name and one really ought to use "gull" as a generic name or "herring gull" etc for paticular species?

And anyway what on earth has that to do with the overhaul of a locomotive that is named after its designer?

Edit: corrected wrong pronoun, "them" (which reflected wording that I abandoned) to "us".

 

Not ducking the question but the designer was well known for his love of birds hence his satisfaction when Mallard became the world-beater in speed terms.

 

They could have named one "Arthur Scargill's Pit Lamp", and she would still be a thing of ultimate beauty......

 

Nothing, but at least it's a tenuous link (unlike pub licensing issues in the ET thread ).

 

The Locomotive Mag in February 1938 stated that 4466 had been named Hirondelle (which is rather prettier than Herring Gull), and 4467 Condor (perhaps not so good as Wild Swan).

 

Note the mistake in the text; I also wonder why the names were subsequently changed given that 4466 was released as Herring Gull but subsequently renamed Sir Ralph Wedgewood in January 1944 to replace the A4 destroyed in the York blitz and 4467 was released as Wild Swan. In response to an earlier query the final logic of the 1946 Thompson renumbering (60000 being added in BR days) was 1 - 6 - the LNER officials named between 1939-1944 then the designer followed by the Commonwealth countries then the original Silver quartet followed by the birds. Interestingly the renaming of Kestrel to Miles Beevor (November 1947); Sea Eagle to Walter K Whigham (October 1947) and Peregrine to Lord Faringdon (March 1948) also commemorated LNER officials in post at nationalisation but appears to be random in the choice of locomotive. The other curiosity was the intended naming of 60009 as Osprey prior to release but the name was allocated to 4494 / 60003 instead yet in the 1980s when apartheid demonstrators posed a possible threat to 60009 it regained the name for a short period; as an aside it also appeared as 60027 Merlin for a short period IIRC.

The history of the 35 A4s still fascinates !

 

I find it interesting that countries of the commonwealth were part of the A4 naming regime including 60009 of course. Yet clearly 60020 fell from favour and was the only one of these renamed (to Guillemot I believe) but didn't Pakistan remain part of the Commonwealth just as did the rest?

 

Well nothing at all. I don't recall anyone complaining?

Whilst we deviate from No7 whilst others are busy completing the awaited overhaul, let's not forget that GWR Bulldog number 3453 - was also named Seagull.

 

https://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9002

 

Certainly was: early morning in September 1991 at Upperby

 

thanks for sharing - I haven't personally seen any photos of this name being carried.

 

I don’t think anyone has suggested there is anything wrong with the name Seagull

 

Post #91

 

The LMS named at least one after a species that never existed, albeit one step removed. It was named after a Royal Navy destroyer, which itself was named after the bird in question. 5736 'Phoenix'.

 

There were a few Phoenixes around.