If you register, you can do a lot more. And become an active part of our growing community. You'll have access to hidden forums, and enjoy the ability of replying and starting conversations.

Locomotives that NEARLY made it

Discussion in 'Steam Traction' started by Hicks19862, Apr 22, 2020.

  1. 8126

    8126 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2014
    Messages:
    823
    Likes Received:
    962
    Gender:
    Male
    No, that makes a lot of sense to me. Yes, there are exceptions, but they fit in the continuum, roughly, and the output of some CMEs shows evolution from one to the other (I'm thinking Adams here), while others found their level and stuck to it (Stirling Singles are lovely, yes, but twenty five years of moderate improvement probably wasn't what the GNR needed).

    Although arguably, since we have Fairburn and Standard 2-6-4Ts, 2500 provides a more historically interesting variation on the LMS 2-6-4T than a 2-cylinder Stanier would.
     
  2. Andy Williams

    Andy Williams Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2010
    Messages:
    851
    Likes Received:
    908
    Occupation:
    Design Engineer
    Location:
    Shropshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    The group of SVR volunteers that saved 43106 had originally tried to purchase one of the last surviving 2-6-4 tanks, but were not able to secure it in the limited time available to them. Had they been successful, there would no doubt be many lamenting the fact that no Ivatt Class 4 had survived into preservation. Likewise, the Manchester Rail Travel Society who saved Jinty 47383 had originally looked to secure one of the earlier Johnson 3F tanks.

    Andy
     
    Johnme101, andrewshimmin, jnc and 2 others like this.
  3. 60044

    60044 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Messages:
    406
    Likes Received:
    785
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Salisbury
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    As Flying Pigs lasted almost as long in the North East as Q6s and J27s its a shame there wasn't one of them saved for the NYMR.... the then IIRC V2s lasted almost as long and I'd rather another of those had made it!
     
    Monkey Magic likes this.
  4. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    15,330
    Likes Received:
    11,667
    Occupation:
    Nosy aren’t you?
    Location:
    Nowhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Didn't they also look at an 82000 was well?
     
  5. martin1656

    martin1656 Nat Pres stalwart Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2014
    Messages:
    17,609
    Likes Received:
    11,223
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    St Leonards
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    The saddest bit, though, has to be those engines that were actually purchased for preservation, and then broken up for use as spares engines, didn't that happen to some of the Barry ten, the 8f for example, was the only surviving one from the LNER batch, the Crab, even though the frames did survive, so much has been lost, that clearly its not a worthwhile job now, So Close to safety, with the possibility of some future restoration, but then lost at the 11th hour.
     
    clinker likes this.
  6. MattA

    MattA Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2014
    Messages:
    309
    Likes Received:
    342
    Location:
    82F
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    The list I've compiled of the Ex-BR engines that those on Nat Pres and elsewhere (RMWeb, Wikipedia) mentioned as "near misses" of some sort is quite substantial;
    • 1607
    • 2937 Clevedon Court
    • 3681
    • 3758
    • 3817
    • 4156
    • 6853 Morehampton Grange
    • 7007 Great Western
    • 7037 Swindon
    • W31 Chale
    • 30538
    • 30900
    • 30952
    • 31610
    • 31757
    • 33006
    • 34005 Barnstaple
    • 34056 Croydon
    • 35012 United States Lines
    • 41224
    • 41230
    • 41284
    • 41286
    • 41295
    • 41319
    • 41320
    • 42210
    • 42414
    • 44781
    • 44888
    • 45526 Morecambe and Heysham
    • 46220 Coronation
    • 46240 City of Coventry
    • 46243 City of Lancaster
    • 46254 City of Stoke-on-Trent
    • 46255 City of Hereford
    • 46400
    • 54398 Ben Alder
    • 60012 Commonwealth of Australia
    • 60014 Silver Link
    • 60145 St Mungo
    • 60158 Aberdonian
    • 62613
    • 65361
    • 65464
    • 65465
    • 69138
    • 70004 William Shakespeare
    • 70036 Boadicea
    • 73034
    • 73053
    • 73136
    • 75048
    • 76016
    • 76080
    • 78529* - not ex-BR itself but 733 classmates were in BR stock
    • 80010
    • 80154
    • 82006
    • 82010
    • 92085
    • Unknown LBSCR 'K'
    • Unknown MR Johnson '3F'
    • 7x Unknown LSWR 'O2's
    • Any of the locomotives scrapped at Barry immediately before Woodham's switched focus to wagons.
    • Anything cut up as a source of donor parts.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
    Monkey Magic, Hicks19862 and jnc like this.
  7. Andy Williams

    Andy Williams Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2010
    Messages:
    851
    Likes Received:
    908
    Occupation:
    Design Engineer
    Location:
    Shropshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Not sure to be honest, but someone else did try to save one of the four 82xxx tanks that were stored at Patricroft until 1968.

    Andy
     
    Hicks19862 likes this.
  8. Hicks19862

    Hicks19862 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    612
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Manchester
    With regards to the J15s on the list, were these the ones stored at Stratford for possible preservation, along with 65462?
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
  9. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2010
    Messages:
    2,377
    Likes Received:
    3,981
    Location:
    i.o.m
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Although I didn't agree with what happened to the 8F at least some useful parts live on to be used on other locos. What happened to the Crab, on the other hand, tells the story of an owner who couldn't/wouldn't face up to reality. When he no longer had the cash/time/enthusiasm to continue the restoration the owner could, and should, have sold it on but chose not to. I fully realise that, human nature being what it is, some of us tend to look through rose-coloured spectacles, ignore the enormity of the task, and as in this case things can go horribly wrong very quickly. Back in the 80's a close friend continued to collect unrestored locos and items of rolling stock long after he could no longer afford them or have any hope of restoring same. Inevitably it led to divorce, severe financial problems and ultimately death at a young age. On the IoM an oft heard phrase among vintage vehicle hoarders is "Gonna do it up one day yessir!" .... but more often than not said vehicle slowly returns to nature.
    The loss of 42859 should be a salutary lesson for all of us.
    Ray.
     
    ragl, ghost, 2392 and 3 others like this.
  10. Hicks19862

    Hicks19862 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2015
    Messages:
    738
    Likes Received:
    612
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Manchester
    Also with regards to J15s, 65469 was to be acquired by the M&GN Society until it was discovered to have a crack in the frames, leading to 65462 being acquired instead.

    Didn’t the Gresley Society originally aim to acquire a Pacific, then thoughts turned to a K3 (rejected as the only one left was a stationary boiler) before settling on the N2 (lovely loco I might add)
     
  11. MattA

    MattA Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2014
    Messages:
    309
    Likes Received:
    342
    Location:
    82F
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    That is my belief - those 4 were the last to be withdrawn, by some margin.
     
    Hicks19862 likes this.
  12. Richard Roper

    Richard Roper Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,310
    Likes Received:
    1,355
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Librarian
    Location:
    Just up the road from 56E Sowerby Bridge
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I don't mind the fake BR livery on the Worth Valley's Dub Dee. It would be nice to see it in WD livery sometime though, with Westo pump as well... I think it was a great piece of luck that a WD 8-wheeled tender chassis was found for it too. Its probably a better performer too, as it retains the compensation levers fitted by the Swedes on the Locomotive.

    Richard.
     
    Johnme101 and Hicks19862 like this.
  13. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    15,330
    Likes Received:
    11,667
    Occupation:
    Nosy aren’t you?
    Location:
    Nowhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Have a feeling the 8 wheel tender was a new build, 1931/32 both had 6 wheel shortened tenders and enclosed cabs (enclosed cabs are rather obvious in Scandavania!) just re-read the article in Steam Railway about the near miss with the other one in Sweden.
    I'll dig it out later but cash and red tape come into it. (Lack of former and plenty of the latter!)
     
    Hicks19862 likes this.
  14. bluetrain

    bluetrain Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2019
    Messages:
    1,326
    Likes Received:
    1,460
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Wiltshire
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    A "new-build" DX in original condition, with no engine or train brakes, and only a low-height windshield for crew protection, would be simply too primitive to operate. As you suggest, a Cauliflower would be more practical. But certainly it would be appropriate for the NRM to have acquired at least one of the 943 "DX", 500 "17-inch Coal Engine"and 310 "Cauliflower" 0-6-0s built by the LNWR.

    It was also unfortunate that none of the Midland Kirtley double-frame 0-6-0s made it to York. These were not only the most numerous type of double-frame engine in Britain, but also provided the test-beds for the work in the late 1850s to develop the brick-arch coal-burning firebox.
     
  15. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2010
    Messages:
    2,377
    Likes Received:
    3,981
    Location:
    i.o.m
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    As Richard said the 8w. chassis is an original (from one of the ex NS Austerities - as was 1931 before it went to SJ) and was found in an Ijmuiden steelworks where it had been used as an ingot carrier. The tank was, indeed, a new-build (by apprentices at Corus Scunthorpe).
    Ray.
     
    Hicks19862 likes this.
  16. marshall5

    marshall5 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2010
    Messages:
    2,377
    Likes Received:
    3,981
    Location:
    i.o.m
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    It may come as a surprise but a DX boiler, mounted on an LNWR tender chassis, survived until spring 1969, on carriage heating duty at Edge Hill carriage sidings. One of the ex L&Y 0-4-4T's kept it company.
    Ray.
     
    andrewshimmin and ragl like this.
  17. Matt37401

    Matt37401 Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    15,330
    Likes Received:
    11,667
    Occupation:
    Nosy aren’t you?
    Location:
    Nowhere
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Fair enough Ray, I was halfway there!
     
  18. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    1,381
    Likes Received:
    1,739
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    34D, now flexible
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    I don't know if this is the original smokebox of a J15 in the museum at Mangapps Farm in Essex?

    DSC_1516.JPG
     
    Hicks19862 likes this.
  19. Jamessquared

    Jamessquared Nat Pres stalwart

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    26,103
    Likes Received:
    57,433
    Location:
    LBSC 215
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    Plane restorers have completed a flyable restoration starting from less than that ...

    Tom
     
  20. misspentyouth62

    misspentyouth62 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    1,381
    Likes Received:
    1,739
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    34D, now flexible
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    No I do not currently volunteer
    Indeed so - even Brighton Atlantics can be returned to life from just an original regulator handle so I've heard?

    Anyone distressed with the loss of an 8F, here's something to get them started : DSC_1521.JPG
     
  21. Martin Perry

    Martin Perry Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator Friend

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2006
    Messages:
    16,510
    Likes Received:
    7,753
    Location:
    1012 / 60158
    Heritage Railway Volunteer:
    Yes I am an active volunteer
    44894 - KWVR wanted to buy it from Drapers but cutting had already started.
     

Share This Page