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West Somerset Railway General Discussion

Discussion in 'Heritage Railways & Centres in the UK' started by gwr4090, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    We had a long conversation about this whilst passing the time of day on 825 last week. Whilst I’m in agreement with most of what you say I still believe that the WSR will survive both Covid and its internal strife simply because that is what nearly everyone wants. That includes the SCC and the banks.
     
  2. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I don’t think the ORR have formally acted at all. However, if the WSR restarted public train services at the moment then they probably would. That is subtly different and is my belief as to why the railway isn’t running.
     
  3. The Dainton Banker

    The Dainton Banker Well-Known Member

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    Can you expand a bit on that, please ? According to the Plc newsletters the required track maintenance has been completed and the only reason for not running is that the level-crossing at Minehead is not functioning properly/safely and will have to wait for the SCC to fix early next year. Is this where the ORR comes in or are there other matters which are concerning them ?
     
  4. Alan Kebby

    Alan Kebby Well-Known Member

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    I think most people find it hard to believe that is the only reason. After all, it wouldn’t stop services being run Dunster to BL or any smaller section of the line in the interim.
     
  5. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    I presume that everyone will have to wait until the AGM of the PLC to find out exactly why the railway isn't operating but the Minehead crossing problem is rather bemusing.

    Taken on face value, if the crossing is the responsibility of Somerset County Council (SCC) and if by it not working safely the railway cannot run then surely that means SCC is restricting the ability of the WSR to earn money. In those circumstances, wouldn't SCC be liable for compensation to the WSR for each non-earning day?

    I find that one rather hard to make sense of.
     
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  6. rodders154

    rodders154 Member

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    In your opinion

    Sent from my SM-T550 using Tapatalk
     
  7. torgormaig

    torgormaig Part of the furniture Friend

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    Indeed Steve, it was that conversation that stimulated me to look closer at this thread and it makes for unbelieveably grim reading - 650 odd posts over 30+ pages in the last 10 days and no concensus to be seen. I don't believe that everyone willing the WSR to survive is sufficient unless there is some agreement as to how this should be achieved and that is clearly lacking at present. It appears that there are no shortage of ideas but each one seems to create more arguements and no solutions. Add to this the fact that the current PLC seems to lack the necessary skill sets to satisify the regulators that they can operate a safe railway and I don't see that the railway is in a fit state to survive. I would be delighted to be proved wrong about this but things look far from promising at present.

    Peter
     
  8. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I can’t really expand on it as I don’t know detail. However the comments come from a (very informed) third party. I am not going to name names. In essence, to run the railway you need a lot of links (resources) to be in place in the chain. If some of these links are missing, the chain is broken and the right decision is not to run passenger trains. The ORR would be of that opinion, as well.
     
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  9. ghost

    ghost Part of the furniture

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    So I assume that by supporting the current board and Chairman, you also support;
    the eviction of the SDRT
    the removal of HR policies and procedures
    the debacle over the sale of 4110
    the removal of ID cards from volunteers who disagree with management
    the 'cuckoo in the nest' statement
    the untrue 'complaints' told about Washford and the untrue ORR investigation
    the lack of running
    the interference from the plc in the affairs of the WSSRT
    the statement about not paying for the overhaul of 53808
    evicting 6695
    evicting 44422
    starting to evict the 169 group (and then changing your mind)
    the censorship of the Facebook 'friends of' page
    the legal action against the local Headmistress
    the mess over the Hinkley point grant
    the shouting and swearing at the WSRA chairman
    the mess over the sale of WSRA restorations & shop

    This is not a debating point, it's a simple yes/no answer.

    Keith
     
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  10. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    I don’t know the facts regarding the crossing and responsibilities but I can imagine that, although SCC has overall responsibility, they will have no knowledge of level crossing equipment and methodology and this aspect will be sub contracted to the WSR. Perhaps it is the case that the WSR doesn’t currently have the resources to fulfil that obligation. Pure speculation from me and happy to be told I’m wrong.
     
  11. Mike S

    Mike S New Member

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    For the love of the WSR will somebody please take a sledgehammer to a particular posters keyboard...

    It is quite obviously never, ever going to be used to answer even a simple question and just adds to the sorry mess....

    Edit: Sorry just realised it's not a keyboard but an SM-T550 Tablet, but same treatment applies.

    2645039-a-smashed-keyboard-with-hammer.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2020
  12. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    That's an interesting intervention and comment.

    Let's agree on one thing. To be able to run a heritage railway, you need to satisfy the same requirements as a TOC to run its trains on the national network.....and you are also responsible for the track and signalling. OK - maybe a subset of what is needed nationally but the ORR will surely apply similar rules.

    If there is a money problem then you can borrow that. If there is a people/expertise/procedures/safety etc problem then you can't easily solve that just with money. So the "sadly the WSR is toast" comment may seem stark but if said by anyone with insights then it may be the reality.
     
  13. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    You put if far more succinctly than me, Peter but that is the essence of what I’m saying. ;)
     
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  14. Monkey Magic

    Monkey Magic Part of the furniture

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    Would you be able to give an example of a chain necessary to run a train? I appreciate that you cannot name names, so a hypothetical example would be good for those of us unfamiliar with the process.
     
  15. simon

    simon Resident of Nat Pres

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    Having gone back to the world of work, I cant read this thread in near real time as I used to at times in the past Stepping back from it and trying to catch up, its apparent that there really isn't anything new, or interesting to say about the WSR.
    Like a car crash, it draws you in, but at some point you just have to get on with life and put it behind you.

    There is nothing new to be said about the mess that is the WSR, yet every day there are several more pages saying what has been said before, and again and again.

    Time for everyone to give it a rest?
     
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  16. goldfish

    goldfish Nat Pres stalwart

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    I'm amused that they were able to stop producing Eastenders for six months but the never-ending soap opera in Somerset just rolls on and on and on… those of us who've had a break from NatPres could do with a 'first episode of a new series re-cap'… ;)

    Simon
     
  17. Steve

    Steve Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    A few examples
    • someone responsible for safety
    • someone responsible for mechanical engineering
    • someone responsible for electrical engineering
    • someone responsible for civil engineering
    • someone responsible for signalling
    • someone responsible for operating
    Not only have these people to be responsible but they also have to have sufficient knowledge and experience to make them competent to undertake the task. You also have to have systems in place to practically implement those responsibilities. For example
    • a system for assessing operational staff
    • a system for assessing and maintaining mechanical equipment (locos, coaches, etc)
    • a system for assessing and maintaining track and infrastructure
    • a system for assessing and maintaining S& T equipment.
    These are just a few examples that will be covered by an overall SMS. I am not saying that any or all of these resources are presently absent on the WSR but, if even one is missing, the chain is broken.
     
  18. simon

    simon Resident of Nat Pres

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    Basically, a number of tribes in an uncivilised area west of Taunton continue to hate each other with a passion and take it out over the body of a near-moribund heritage railway. They all profess to love it, but would rather it wither and die than some of another tribe be left in charge. None of them can see that they might have had some part in its failing. All of them remain convinced that the dead body would rise up and flourish like never before as if only the others would F**** off and never return.

    Each tribe being equally convinced that there's is the only one true way.
     
  19. staffordian

    staffordian Well-Known Member

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    Many thousands of posts ago, didn't someone say that the problem was not the repairs to the track, but the loss of personnel able to certify the repairs as being safe?

    Clearly the level crossing is still an issue, but even if that is sorted, the track certification problem presumably remains?
     
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  20. Fish Plate

    Fish Plate New Member

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    Crickey @Steve, it's almost like you actually have some real-world experience of operating a heritage railway!

    To pick up a point you made earlier, what I don't understand about the level crossing at Minehead is that if it's unservicable now, then it was also unservicable (or very nearly so) in March when the intention was to start operating the railway's usual timetable. So given that one of the reasons given for not running trains now is that the crossing unservicable, surely that would have also impacted running trains in the normal timetable had Covid not happened? That seems like a bit of a contradiction.

    Also, with regards to track, I think it's the case that the work has been completed but there is nobody with the comptency to sign off the work, as the one person who could do so has departed for pastures new. So, as you rightly point out, the "system for assessing and maintaing track and infrastruture" is one of the key links that is missing and, as the Board have identified, it is going to be difficult to fill that post.
     
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