Lynton and Barnstaple - Operations and Development

if the figures quoted for this building being bandied abound at WB in general conversation are correct then its a very expensive 'temporary structure'that might never recoup its cost,then again at the current rate of progress it might pay for itself 3 times over before WB is a through station again,maybe its happening just to boost someone's ego while sheds at rowley moor are falling apart and those rather expensive carriages that many many supporters/enthusiasts have forked out hard earned cash to build along with all the hard work of messers Ely,Summers and the volunteers that have done such a brilliant job on stand outside in the notorious North Devon weather constantly taking a good soaking and generally starting to show the effect of such despite the hard work of the paint shop boys,yes,customer care is important as they pay for the rides but thought for supporters and what they have helped pay for is just as important

 

Well from the L&B website, the tea room building has been approved and they have applied for some grant funding.

 

If the new building shares the same footprint as the existing structure - how does it work now? Look forward to hearing the longer-term solution.

 

At the moment, if the S&T need access to the back of the SB, AIUI they just unclip part of 'tent' and move it aside - clearly not possible with a fixed wall. The 'extra electrical gubbins' do not exist at the moment, but will be needed in readiness for Phase 2A, as also will be the concrete hut to house associated instrumentation (not shown on the site plan, but been there for years already).

 

Tea rooms and cafés do seem to become contentious issues on narrow gauge railways

 

Doth the ghost of Captain Jack Howey stalk our threads?

If the aim of the L&B was to create (a useful building, plus) a homage to SR 'house style', I'd say they've succeeded rather well.

 

Do not forget that in the later years post-1923 a lot of the L&BR took on the SR 'house style' in terms of architecture, infrastructure and paint schemes etc. As the 1923-35 period represents about 1/3rd of the total life of the L&BR, it would be hard - if not inappropriate - to try to ignore it.

However I'm not sure that the particular design of building chosen for the new Tea Room screams "SR Western Section" at me, I'd be interested to know the prototype on which it was based.

 

Most certainly "inappropriate" .... says someone who wouldn't mind seeing a VoR set dipped in woad again!

 

i have had conversation with someone who is a bit of an expert on railway paint schemes and he says there is no evidence that southern green was used on any of the stations,much rather lswr brown,salmon and cream being used throughout its life

 

Given the L&B was inspected by LSW personnel ahead of grouping, I wonder how much was "that needs a repaint right now" and how much could be left until the new 'corporate scheme' came into being? I recall a comment that paint on most stock was in good order and there was no great rush to apply SR livery* (Lew being the first loco to appear in Southern garb, on delivery), but have never seen any similar statement concerning the buildings or station 'furniture'.

It'd certainly be interesting to learn, assuming any definitive answer is possible after 97 years!

*on the central section, before his retirement, Lawson Billinton insisted on using up stocks of LBSC Umber. Quite when this ceased though, I don't know.

 

Some years ago I helped recover parts from a demolished LBSCR workman's cottage from Haywards Heath, and you could still see the history of painting on some of the wooden components - one interesting discovery being that the windows appeared to have been pre-fabricated and painted off site, and then just installed ready made into their apertures; that original (1840s?) paint was still the upper surface where the windows had been rebated into the walls.

So it is not beyond the bounds of possibility that, even after 97 years, you could still understand the paint schemes, at least for a specific building, if any original woodwork still survives.

I think there is a general over-estimation of how fast things got repainted, particularly buildings. Photos of Kingscote in the mid 1950s show the wartime visibility stripes still very clearly; so presumably the paint underneath can be no later than late 1930s, and possibly older - well into the BR period. So the comment by @Meatman that the stations retained LSWR colours to the end is certainly not outlandish; it represents less time retaining the "old" colours than at Kingscote.

Tom

 

Ah! Here we go folks "The Son of Livery" debate. This time round it's all stationary....... Though seriously I've been pondering this whole scenario and have come to the following conclusion. Bearing in mind how various lines have used variations of the BR era colour scheme. My line the NYMR have come up with IMO the better idea, insomuch as each of the 4 main stations is set in a different time period; Pickering is set in the LNER era just before WW2 [1938+/-], Levisham and Goathland are set in the North Eastern era either side of the Great War [1920+/- & 1910 +/-] and Grosmont in the BR era 1948-65. Granted there are principally only to possible eras to choose from for the L & B, but they could set each station in a set period of those eras.

 

We do that on the Bluebell - but it starts to get interesting in concept. For example , Kingscote is presented 1950s style - but that has been taken to mean using the 1950s corporate colours. Which is demonstrably not what the station looked like in the 1950s, as per photographic evidence. The distinction grates on me; I have long argued the point, but generally to deaf ears.

So “presenting the stations as a historical sequence” is a worthy aim, but it should in my view be evidence based. In the L&B case, quite possible that not much would change through the years except signage, posters etc.

Tom

 

One of the problems then is that, although you may be able to choose a specific 'style', it is very unlikely that any one station remained totally unchanged until such time as the next 'style' was applied. Various bits would have been altered/repainted over the years. A modeller might well decided to model one specific station at a specific date/year, but such a luxury is not likely to be available to the L&BR, so then you have to accept some compromise.

For example, if you decided to reinstate (say) Chelfham in 'Edwardian' style, then do you not fit a nameboard on the signal-box (as such things appear not to have existed pre-1923), or do you fit one because it is the modern requirement to have such a thing on an operational box, in which case then there is not only the 'discrepancy in style' in having one but also in whatever colour scheme you apply to it (which by definition must itself be non-authentic). Also, what would you then do with the existing SR-period concrete running-in boards?

 

With the best will in the world, all we can honestly hope for is the ambience generated by as faithful a representation as can be managed. Deviation from historical precedent, occasioned by compliance with modern legislation, is merely one cause of departure from accuracy. Others, perhaps, come as a result of errors perpetuated in established written works (no names!).

On the other hand, it always tickles me to see endless enamelled signs advertising this or that tobacco product in places where use of same is now forbidden and even in this day and age, olfactory evidence too often suggests some could usefully heed the signage promoting various soaps.

 

Wonder how long this ones going to hang around Bewdley...

 

There have been some interesting replies to my thoughts as the "house styles" available to the new L & B. To which I say thanks, in response I sight the likes of Beamish insomuch as whilst they are trying to portray towns-capes from different eras, they also have to meet modern building regulations. Which they have, as they've masked very well when it comes to say the wiring for the electrical systems. Likewise the "No Smoking" signage, whilst yes there is the official sign the regulations are flexible enough to allow for any sort of similar signage that says "no Smoking"........

 

There is a design justification document in the planning application which gives some examples:
https://planningapi.agileapplications.co.uk/api/application/document/EXMOOR/272429

 

I'll go with Howard here- ambience is the most important thing to consider, at least for the visitor.
What sways me towards SR house colours is;
1)- the Southern were very keen on house style, witness how well represented Exmouth Junction's products were. The rolling stock was certainly all in SR livery by the early 1930s.
2) - The Trust's aim is to recreate as close as is physically and practically possible, the final years of the L&Bs existence.
3)- As I'm sure most of us know, no matter how well applied, 12 years is a very long time between repaints for building woodwork!

 

Well done Martyn for drawing attention to this document.