A2 60532 Blue Peter

Having been one of those who paid that charge I would contend that with (a) the rising costs of maintaining preserved locomotives (b) the decreasing number of enthusiasts willing to support preservation and (c) the decreasing number of opportunities to organise such events then the only way to help fill the funding gap is to accept that "if you want it then you must pay for it" (whatever "it" is !). You may disagree but IMHO the NRM has the resources to organise such an event, the space the display the locos concerned and the need for funds to continue its existence whether you accept its policies or not.

 

My point was that they made a big loss on the A4 event.

 

Doesn't change my view that the NRM - or any other organiser - must level a charge that covers the cost of the event and enthusiasts will have to pay the appropriate charges else events won't happen. It's a cruel world but money talks and if it doesn't then nowt will happen.

 

There is a concept called price saturation and if the charge is above that then it's not viable. To illustrate what I mean, if a heritage line increased it's fares by 20% and then lost 20% of it's customers as a result they are back to square one. I think the problem with the Great Gathering was that the cost of running it could not be covered by what people were prepared to pay.
The prospect of photographing a line up of A4s in front of what looked like a modern sports hall did nothing for me so I didn't take much interest in what was going on.

 

But remember that if custom falls by 20% then there would be a reduction in costs as the line would reduce services to meet the reduced demand hence income could be greater than the costs. Thus a gala could still make money by increasing price but reducing costs (e.g by not hiring in 'guest locomotives') whereas an NRM display with fixed costs has to balance that financial equation very carefully. The organiser of any event has to carefully also to consider what the market will bear (i.e. what customers will be willing to pay) - a factor which was critical to the success of the A4 Great Gatherings of 2013 when the presence of 60008 / 10 was an unrepeatable element that justified the higher price - and which was paid by many including me.

 

The A4 great gathering was exceptional, though, in terms of the costs involved. bringing the two locos from N. America. The next event, should there be one on the lines of V2, P2 A1, A2, A3, A4(s), would be considerably cheaper to stage, one would hope!

 

Then you missed out big time IMO.
Shildon 01 The Great Goodbye by KING COBRA 92, on Flickr

 

I would be interested to see where you get that from John, with respect. My understanding of how the finances worked was that it wasn't that simple.

 

I've got to say I prefer them without valances, colour ?? the green ones, 2nd and 3rd from the top

 

Just as a matter of maths, a reduction in custom and/or income may not result in a reduction in costs.

 

Or an odd black one....

 

I think you just have to do the sums, it was a horrendously expensive exercise

 

Everything in life does not have to produce a profit, or wipe it face. Many of the best ideas or ones that last in our memories, are ones that you cannot put a cost on.

The A4 great gathering was one of those, that allowed so many normal people to get up close with these fantastic loco's.

It may have been expensive, but in comparison with other wastes on money, in my view it was worth every penny.

And i congratulate the NRM on having the foresight to do it, and sharing with the masses.

 

Well said...a once in a lifetime experience which you cannot put money on it. Like the new P2 build, properly financed however, but hopefully a locomotive that I have always regarded as being most elegant, that I never dreamed I would ever see. Providing I'm still around and not wheelie bin ash...

 

Right, so show me where I find the sums for your claim, John. There was a lot of sponsorship, merchandise, and most of the photography events sold out.

 

Agree completely - provided that the uncovered costs (I refuse to say "losses") are at a sufficiently limited level that they don't jeopardise other activities.

 

Rightly or wrongly the NRM is a very different place these days. The whole culture and ethos has changed noteable in the decade since Nos 8 and 10 returned to these shores in 2012, as seen here


The NRM's Masterplan for York seems to have no facilities in it to permit any form of future show of large railway vehicles there. Were anything like it (? S&D 200) to happen again I suspect it would be held at Shildon rather than York.

Peter

 

A sentiment doubtless shared by all embarrassed to have to "use the one in McDondald's".

 

This had me scratching my head. If you had 100 visitors at £10, your gross income is £1,000. Increase fare to £12, lose 20% of visitors, gross income is then £960. Your overheads would be unchanged, operating costs would be barely affected if at all, and now you've only got 80 people to sell tea and sandwiches to. You'd probably be back to square o.8

 

I think preserved railways have a solid 60 year track record of not having a clue how much to charge

Tom