Lynton and Barnstaple - Operations and Development

already have an idea for that problem

 

Are people getting a little carried away here?

The reasons for setting Blackmoor as a railhead, with lots of parking space and a pub cafe restaurant, are to enable a park and ride for tourists to enjoy travelling on a tourist railway and (eventually with Stage 2b completed) reach Lynton, so reducing vehicle movements to Lynton and Lynmouth. The financial, social and environmental returns would potentially be great and would surely delight the residents of Lynton and Lynmouth. The southern extension completion could be financed by proceeding this way.

What benefits are there from running a train from Snapper, which is in the middle of nowhere with no parking, to Chelfham, which is also in the middle of nowhere with no parking, and on to Bratton Fleming which is, you've guessed it: in the middle of nowhere with no parking? The only reason I can think of would be to satisfy railway nerds with a longer line. The benefits are much reduced and far more limited in scope.

Yes, we all want a longer railway, but let's please be practical.

 

I see the situation differently. NOT as a proposal to run trains from Snapper to places further north, but rather to start from BR - as the railhead, for the reasons that you describe - with trains running to places further south. After all, it is merely an extension - albeit quite a long one - of the line from BR to Whistlandpound, and no-one seems too bothered about the lack of vehicle access to WD.

This is an alternative to be pursued possibly if the section from KL to BR fails to materialise any time in the near future. Surely it would be better to do 'something' like that, rather than face the prospect of yet more years - and for how long? - of just running on the same WB-Kl section as currently happens?

 

Plan X-2 could of course run from WB to Lynton, though there's virtually no trackbed owned as yet.

 

As I understand it there are more problems trying to break out of Woody Bay either way you go. Trackbed from Caffyns to Lydiate Lane might be possible as most of the current landowners have indicated their support the building of the line.

From what I have been told going north from Woody Bay to Caffyns is going to be difficult since at least one landowner has said no, again I do not know exactly just how many landowners there are between Woody Bay and Lynton or what the issues are and why they have said no at this time.

The worse case scenario would be that the current plan would fail and that we also can't go back to Lynton any time soon and that also nothing happens at Blackmoor.

If all of that happens then some serious rethinking will be required and in the mean time any of the trackbed that we need elsewhere could also change hands.

That is why I think we need to have an open and honest discussion about trackbed purchases', sure you don't want to spoke any of the landowners by going public, but at the same time a fresh fundraising effort to enable trackbed purchase also needs to take place.

 

The problems with going south from Blackmoor further than Wistlandpound would have to be considered before embarking on such a project. It is fraught with difficulties and therefore expense, apart from any difficulty persuading landowners to part with trackbed. Firstly there is the cost of a new railway for a bit more than 5/8 mile from Bridge 52 to the dam as the trackbed and Bridges 48 to 51 were destroyed in the construction of the reservoir in the early 50s, two of which are over streams feeding the reservoir and therefore essential. Then the line has to get across or (more likely), under, the road across the dam. Beyond that the trackbed for about the next just over 1/2 a mile is the access road to South Thorne and would also need to be replaced in a situation where both pieces of trackbed are on the side of hills. Then the section between Hunnacott and Narracott, converted into a public road, would have to be replaced - another section a bit more than 5/8 mile, and the replacement would almost certainly encounter the rock that James Nuttall felt he had to blast, judging by the rock cuttings north of milepost 9. And that is before the replacement bridges for those since destroyed such as Lancey Brook Viaduct.

 

Hi Michael

I would like to add that I am sure I read in one of the back issues of the magazine that South West Water have refused us to have a trackbed lower than that of the top of the dam.

If that is still the case then it will either have to be a level crossing or a new over bridge at the North Thorn Farm end of the Dam.

Again from this point it is all up for grabs, there has been a suggestion in the past that in order to help with gradient we might like to think about heading toward Exmoor Zoo as another source of passengers, again this will need to be worked out as a civil engineering project.

I have seen suggestions that we consider either a long lazy S or a double spiral loop to reach the track bed level at Hunnacott from the zoo.

Again I am in no position to say this is what should be done as I agree with you it does need to be investigated properly by a civil engineering team, one thing is for sure what ever gets chosen is going to be a bit special.

 

I am told - by a member with experience of such matters - that there are possible alternative routes to get around the reservoir area about which details have been provided to the Trustee(s) concerned.

One issue not receiving much (public) attention is whether the chosen site for the station/halt at Whistlandpound is actually in the right location for the longer term, given the uncertainty at the moment as to the future route southwards.

 

It would not surprise me that it would not be allowed to have the trackbed below the potential highwater mark. When there were objections to the inconvenience that would be caused by two level crossings across main roads in Barnstaple in 1894 the possibility of obviating the one at Pilton Causeway by the railway going under it was a non-starter because of the highwater mark of the adjacent River Yeo. (And the alternative of raising the road over the railway would involve 1 in 22 gradients in the approaches either side which it was considered horses would find impossible)

 

The fear expressed here resulting from not getting the L & B on the 'events' list of Heritage Railways in time for the January Magazines is exemplified by the report in yesterday's 'Times' newspaper with an article announcing that the Severn Valley Railway is to lay off 18 staff. Due, it says, to the rising price of coal and electricity to power the stations. A spokesman has said they are on a bit of a white-knuckle ride at the moment. The number of passengers has fallen as the cost of living crisis bites. Last summer's predicted stay-cation didn't materialise as hoped. Numbers are down by a fifth on pre-covid days. They are doing as much, the Railway says, as they can to ensure that the railway remains viable.

The SVR must be reliant on day-trips, whereas the L & B must rely more on holidays spent in North Devon, but the need to get publicity in in due time (however as yet unworked out) must surely be a high priority to ensure the L & B isn't one of the Heritage Railway Association's 150 members of which it says 'if they don't get the visitors numbers coming then we could see some casualties'.

We have to hope the Management have done their sums before taking on a paid position of a fitter. (the writer was formerly an Accountant, so invariably the purveyor of unwelcome views when it came to proposals for spending)

 

Goodness knows what the Festiniog Deviationists would have thought if they'd had a similar prognosis beforehand. Mountains out of molehills springs to mind! Have we entirely lost the ability to anything of significance as volunteers?

 

You over-estimate the importance of such publicity. It may be a missed opportunity for the enthusiast community, but I suspect it scarcely registers for the general tourist market. On my previous visits to Woody Bay, the furthest in advance that I have planned has been a fortnight or so in advance, and the actual visit has always been more conditional on other factors (weather, family plans, progress of journey) more than it has been on information being available.

The same has been true of other railways in holiday areas, where my ability to "play trains" has been heavily conditioned by my need for family forbearance.

 

Michael, last year the railway recorded record passenger numbers despite less than ideal advertisement. This trend is expected to continue into this season. Also yes as it happens the railway have done the sums for the fitter role, not least because said role is vital to the continued operation/expansion of the railway.

 

OK I will say it, it is great that the railway is thinking in terms of expansion at this moment in time and yes it is great that we can employ another person, nothing wrong in that.

However in light of what is happening with ENPA, I would have guessed it might have been prudent to wait to see what happens after all it is only 2 week away, if we get the planning all well and good. If we don't, well that opens' up a whole new can of worms.

Regardless of what anyone may think, I do want this railway to success, but we cannot afford to be reckless. I for one don't want to see this railway being one of the casualties and closing.

 

Nothing the railway is doing is 'reckless'.

 

Irrespective of what issues there may be with the extension project, it seems a bit over the top to assume that the railway management can't draw a distinction between day to day operation of the existing railway, and carrying forward the extension. In even the best case, the extension won't be in place this year; trains will need maintaining.

 

Well said - some 'supporters' are very negative.

 

I am on the side of caution, some may say over-caution, having seen too many cases in a 40-year career as an Accountant of organisations getting into a dangerous financial situation and then going bust 18 months later after things got worse. Is this what happened at Llangollen ? There no evidence that this is likely to happen here. When my wife took the car for service at a big dealer last week the lady on the desk saying she had been inundated with people bringing their cars back because they could no longer afford them. Which makes me think that what happened last summer is not necessarily an indication of what might happen this summer if people cannot contemplate a holiday in North Devon with the cost of living crisis. If the SVR are making 18 staff redundant (or at least laying them off) that represents a substantial proportion of their workforce even if some are part-time and suggests the perceived need to save a substantial amount of the wage bill to make ends meet. I suspect the fitter position will not be offered until the results of the sec 73 decision are known. If I was a decision-maker on the railway I would probably holding confirming an appointment until later this year to see if takings justify the commitment, regardless of how essential such a post might be considered to be. The dangers of finding too late that it cannot be afforded are too great IMHO.

 

Whilst we all appreciate your concerns I think they are somewhat unfounded, The L&B is certainly not the Severn Valley and thankfully we have been seeing a steady increase in passenger numbers since COVID partially thanks to the kids ride free offer that was implemented last year.

 

Must be lovely to be retired , work weekdays only or be self employed .

I fight for my time off and need to get hoilday slips in 6 months in advance