West Somerset Railway General Discussion

It’s a very good question. There is no doubt that the WSR and the Minehead Railway were both laid out to minimize cost, but then, what railway wasn’t? The gradients are steep and the curves tight.
The original track layout was very simple. I suspect that the Minehead Railway directors were working to a much tighter budget than the WSR, witness the cheapness of BA station, the line across
the beach and that they bankrupted their contractor by pinning him down on cost so tightly.
However, despite being designed to be within a limited budget, there is no evidence to suggest that the work was somehow substandard or shoddy. The rails, for example, were manufactured to the
specification of the B&E who inspected things before opening. You might say that the design of Washford cutting was inadequate as we have had landslips there and Black Monkey bridge lacks
adequate buttresses, but both have survived since 1874 with just routine maintenance. The WSR, in particular, had to rush things as opening day approached and it took two visits by the BOT inspector
to approve opening, as he found on his first visit “no lodges at the level crossings, and several minor points unfinished”. But his description of the railway reads perfectly fine. He seemed to have no worries.
As time went on, various improvements were made by the GWR and, again, there is no evidence to suggest that the work was somehow lacking. Indeed, with the extensions to Minehead and Crowcombe buildings, great pains were taken to match the original designs exactly when cheaper brick extensions might have done. Costs were saved where possible, and Dunster, Leigh Bridge and Kentsford signal boxes were all secondhand, but this doesn’t
make them any the less. I have copies of all the BOT inspectors reports for all the
improvements over the years and these detail the exact rail weights and sections, formation, ballasting etc and this all appears to be perfectly normal for the period. The whole line was covered by seven PW gangs each of between 4 and 6 men who latterly were provided with
motorised trolleys. After the general strike, the gangs were rationalised and some who had been on strike were summarily dismissed without any process. In the 1930s, the whittaker apparatus was provided and so-called “high-speed” pointwork installed at the crossing loops,
again, no suggestion that this was not done correctly.
This was not some kind of gimcrack impoverished light railway, but a significant and busy branch line of the biggest and most profitable railway company in the country (world?) and
things were done to the normal GWR standards, which was once characterised as “belt, braces, two bits of string and a spare belt and string in my pocket”.
Happy to discuss further!
Ian Coleby

 

Forward looking statements rather than speculation I feel. I don’t see anyone wishing for its demise.

 

Happy for my resignation letter to be made public.

 

Do the records say whether ash was extensively used, either for embankments or subsequent repairs?

Reading the (monster!) infrastructure report in the latest Bluebell News, our team relaid 36 panels (720 yards) of track this winter in two separate sections, which included very substantial work on an embankment to remove or stabilise where the original construction had used large amounts of ash - hopefully a repair for decades to come. The ash had been causing significant issues, not least that the local bunny population preferentially dug in to the ash and caused subsidence when their burrows collapsed.

I seem to recall that the GWSR also had issues with ash-filled embankments that required significant stabilisation work - and that on a line originally built to (then) mainline standards.

Tom

 

Nor do I. (Please name and shame if there is someone.) But some of us do fear its demise.

 

I have walked every inch of the WSR over the years and much of the main lines I managed at one time.

Much of the WSR was built and maintained to very high standards but some of the infrastructure has been there a long time. There certainly were until recently (and probably still are) stretches of 45’ rails (the US standard sent over during WW2) welded up into 180’ lengths to replace 3 60’s.

How worn the head and how ‘failed’ the foot of rails that have been in place for 80 years, I cannot say.

The ‘Minehead Railway’ from Watchet was clearly more cheaply built, with steep cutting and embankments that need watching. The stretch below Washford also has ‘Black Monkey’ Bridge which is tall for a masonry bridge and is the ‘ruling’ structure on the branch.

BTW the name comes from the fact that it spanned an ancient monks’ path from a monastery (long lost) to the sea.

Robin

 

The original reports from 1862 and 1874 are silent on the make up of the embankments. For the Minehead railway, we have the contrators notebook where he shows how he was using all the cut from the cuttings as fill for the embankments, so i don't think there would have been ash then.
The loop extensions similarly say nothing, but as these were just extensions of existing loops, then i guess its not significant.
The report for Leigh Bridge loops says "The formation is tipped ashes. " Kentsford was in a cutting so was excavation rather than building up. Of course both of these loops have been taken out and the current line uses the original formation.
The Minehead doubling (1934) says "The formation is ash tipped, and the track throughout is laid with 97½lb secondhand material. Chairs weigh 52lb and are secured by two chairbolts. The rails are 44’ 6” long, and the sleepers are new, creosoted and spaced at standard intervals. The ballast is limestone. The fencing is 8 wire type, having concrete posts, 12’ apart, with corax droppers. " The maximum embankment hight is 2' 6".
For the Norton doubling (1937), the report says "On embankments, ashes have been used as bottom ballast, with 9” limestone on the top. Depths below the underside of sleepers varies, from 9½” to 1’0½”. "
I don't have any info on maintenance.
Ian C

 

The use of Ash, as Bottom Ballast and in many cases Top Ballast, is very common throughout the country.
The use of Blast Furnace slag is also common.

 

Sadly not in my gift to comment on that or the circumstances that led up to it as you know.

 

You should all try to attend the railway soon and ask some questions of the rank and file volunteers you find there. Perhaps that will assist in giving you perspective? Perhaps you will find an oppressed and fearful team who think they are treated unfairly? Or perhaps not? Perhaps the evidence of you own eyes and ears will prove useful to the ongoing debate?

 

You seem to be replying here about a completely different issue! The posts you quoted all refer to a lacklustre fundraising campaign. Naturally as enthusiasts we wouldn't want to see the demise of the WSR, so we don't want to see an unsuccessful fundraising campaign.

Your response is to say volunteers *aren't* being oppressed!? What? Who mentioned that here? I'm sure the WSR is a lovely place on the ground full of dedicated volunteers, like most railways. That has no bearing on whether a social media fundraising campaign is successful or not.

 

Of course, you guys are right and I am wrong. I forgot which "pile on" I was replying to.
But if you did visit you'd put around £100 into the railway, that would help. You might be minded to give a donation. You might spend some money locally, that would help the local economy as well.

 

In the "other" thread, I made reference to the excellent book on Oberstdorf. One of the things that comes out in there is that people being content in their daily life is not a reliable indication of underlying mood, and that asking direct questions may well not deliver reliable or honest answers about that mood. This was for a variety of reasons, and not just the obvious ones about living within a dictatorship.

I therefore have no doubt that if I visited the WSR, I would find volunteers who are content, and who would express themselves in support of the railway. What I'm unsure of is what that feedback would tell me as an outsider.

What caught my eye in connection with Combe Florey, and the recent discussion highlights, is how insular the WSR seems. It is almost as though it's the Milwall of heritage railways, where "everyone hates us and we don't care".

In the context of appeals started, and then stopped, and messages given about the state of infrastructure and then not followed through on, I'm confused about the real position of the railway. With Schrodinger's appeal, seeking funds but not needing them, I'm hardly likely to dip my hand into my pocket. And that is irrespective of any discussion about the chairman, or the way he runs the railway.

 

Just because your paranoid Pete, doesn’t mean their not out to get you

 

And that's just for a ham and cheese toastie...

 

Convince me to make a visit.

 

The scenery, the line, the friendly staff, the loco action and the destination. Pretty much the same as other heritage railways.