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CME 2023

Discussion in 'What's Going On' started by Oswald T Wistle, Jan 6, 2023.

  1. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Like the second shot.
     
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  2. Bodorganboy

    Bodorganboy Member

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    46115getting a push on today's CME
     
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  3. nige757

    nige757 Member

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    46115 seen from Shap Wells with plenty of assistance from 37706 then on the return at Stockber in the afternoon heat.

     
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  4. Oswald T Wistle

    Oswald T Wistle Well-Known Member Friend

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    Diesel or no diesel, it was a done deal, a decision already made. It was less than 3 weeks to Midsummer's Day, the sun was shining and the train was due at the top of Wilpshire Bank somewhere between 17.15 and 17.30. There are very few occasions when a steam hauled train is scheduled, the sun is shining and is high enough in the sky to light the bottom of the deep cutting in which Wilpshire Summit is located - today was one!

    Mrs W had returned from her walk a little earlier than planned and, because it was sunny, decided to accompany me to Wilpshire Summit. Following the failure of the 37 (well done, Graham!), 46115 would be tackling the climb without assistance. [Yesterday, I went for a walk in the countryside near home. Wistle Towers is located about 700ft above sea level. Although we have had little or no rain for 3 weeks, the vegetation alongside the tracks and paths was thick and green. A little higher up the hill (c 900ft) a bed of reeds and scrub showed no new growth and during the previous week had been set on fire by yobs - 4 fire appliances required. Higher still c 1150ft the moors were looking very dry, a fire waiting to happen. So WCRC's use of a diesel is perhaps understandable.]

    We set ourselves up on the overbridge and waited. The train had lost time on the climb to Ais Gill but with the generous allowance between Hellifield and Horrocksford, it left Clitheroe only 1L. No need to worry about service trains - strike day. [The times didn't appear on RTT until last night/this morning and were a somewhat abbreviated with no time shown for Ramsgreave & Wilpshire (it would probably be around 17.20).] Then there was the sound of a Stanier hooter (tunnel in?) followed a little later by another and then the sound of a hard working Scot. After what seemed an age she appeared in the far distance, blasting away, no sign of steam or smoke. As she drew nearer, above the chimney was a column of clear, shimmering haze blasting skywards. The visual and auditory treat went on for much longer than if we had been on the station platform. With half the train over the summit the regulator was closed and SG coasted down the hill to Blackburn.

    21C with a playful easterly breeze, RT and (over the summit) 27mph. It was quiet on the bridge, only us two and a couple walking a dog. A lovely watch in the sun but we could do with some rain.

     
  5. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    What more could you want on a summer's evening than the sound of a blackbird accompanied by the steady even beat of a Scot climbing towards you?
     
  6. 30910

    30910 Member

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    SG in the Lune Gorge and at Ais Gill:
     
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  7. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Absolutely and the TOC makes tha call unless it was told by NR.

    So the curious thing is that it was needed from Carnforth but when the DL failed it wasn't needed for the S&C. What changed that meant it was suddenly OK? The weather certainly didn't and therefore whatever the risk was. Anyway, I guess it was an unexpected bonus for the travellers..
     
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  8. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

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    Those on the CME were also lucky to get back so early, which should not be surprising as it was one of the few trains running. However I have been on a CME where we arrives at Rugby 20 early, with a green when we pulled in, and despite the protestations from our guard we were set down only the despatchers view was you will leave right time. Of course during the "debate" the signal reverted to red after about 5 minutes.
     
  9. RalphW

    RalphW Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Administrator Friend

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    Warrington can be like that with returning Chester Dalesman. I always thought the signaller with the bigger picture was in charge, not the local station staff.
     
  10. MellishR

    MellishR Resident of Nat Pres Friend

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    Possibly the thinking was that there was some risk of starting a lineside fire, so the diesel was there to reduce the risk, but even without the diesel the risk did not become bad enough to justify holding the train at Upperby while another diesel could be sent from Carnforth.
     
  11. sgthompson

    sgthompson Part of the furniture Friend

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    I remember talking with Gordon Hodgson in Crewe the night before he was in charge of 6233 over Shap with 5043 following behind on another tour with Gordon saying he was under orders not to start any fires with him saying the Castle would and he was right so out of interest can a loco be driven to negate fires?
     
  12. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    Too many factors at play, I suggest but you can start with the quality of the spark arrestor.

    I wouldn't presume to suggest how to minimise the risk. It's probably possible but some locos are more risky that others and that's before you consider the route. I'll leave it there!
     
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  13. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    Nothing much to do so decided to drop this in as we did have an old fashioned CME, albeit a subdued one.

    UK Steam Hauled Tour 939; 2023 tour 7.


    Cumbrian Mountain Express 3rd June 2023

    Into the unknown sort of day. We'd has 3 successive Saturdays of proper Steam Hauled trains but with every day of almost wall to wall sunshine, the spectre of show pony steam was hanging over us. It's not been excessively hot and the last 3 weekends in different parts of the country showed linesides to be verdant green rather than scorched and brown. Plenty of dew in the mornings to dampen things down until lunchtime. We knew Network Rail were running on a Green Fire Risk Status so there shouldn't have been a need for a dreaded diesel on the rear. Only TfW were running service trains on parts of the WCML. A few freights that ran as required night be around, but nothing due over the S&C but us!!

    So the usual Saturday morning. Up at 5, 2 hour drive, took the Astra out to play, excellent full English breakfast and pancakes in the Brocklebank; then onto Crewe Weston Road Car Park and down onto Crewe Platform 6 in plenty of time. Weirdly no stewards were there and only 20 or so passengers, including Bill who often shares a milepost table with me.

    We were timed to leave Crewe 20 minutes earlier, 0918. No idea why as there were no other trains going north and the slot was virtually the same from Carnforth. Looking around there were TfW trains in Platforms 6,11 and in the bay, P8. Typically a few minutes before Les Ross was allowed off the south junction, the station announcer told all passengers for the Charter Train to go across to Platform 12. We got to Carnforth on time and then it went pear shaped. An extremely annoyed Les, our Train Manager, came to tell us West Coast were putting a diesel on the back due to the Fire Risk. Not a mention about it before. Interestingly a number of first time and occasional travellers were more annoyed than we were at not having a proper steam hauled train.

    The depot sent 37706 out, belching thick blue smoke into the atmosphere as it passed us on the main to be able to access the loop and attach to the rear. WCR are getting very risk averse these days and seems quite happy to ruin 300+ passengers days out for any reason, the favourite in the last couple of years being adverse rail conditions. 'Where and what' were never explained to the passengers and we had the diesel on all day. If JS thinks that's unfair, sobeit. Simple solution: Communication. Well, there we were trapped on the train all day, a carriage and a half from the noisy Class 37 that everyone heard as soon as it was attached. Joy.

    Thought I might as well time as I'd printed out the timing sheets and if I could be bothered, compare it to the 46115+11+Class 47 we had on the 28th January this year, that time because of perceived adverse rail conditions. Speeds from the 28th ar in brackets here and there. Not surprisingly we were let out when we were ready and we heard the Scot as we left the loop. 37706 quiet(?) on the back. Always amuses me that anyone bothers taking pictures or films the trains when it's a Show Pony Train. Still I suppose its past of history sad to say. The diesel kicked in as we began climbing Yealand Bank. Normally even 10 back the Scot made itself heard but today it might just have well been a cardboard cut out. Why bother working the Scot when there's that much horse power on the back could well have been the crew's view.

    The bear and his minder had been a bit odd and we could have sworn they disappeared for a while when we were in the loop. The views were the same as they'd been on the CME on 13th May, stunning, and the lineside was greened up. Might have been possible to set a fire with a blow torch. New stopwatch worked properly. Summit speed was 39.2 (51.5). No need to rush to Milnthorpe so we heard nowt from up front and only saw some thin brownish smoke hardly lifting above the chimney when we saw the Scot on the curves. Past mp13 at 64 (76) but who cared? Liked what I was seeing as speed fell steadily suggesting the crew on the footplate were letting the train weight 'lean back' on the Class 37 that was rather noisy behind us. Through Oxenholme at 49.6 (55) and little from the front on the rest of the climb to pass Grayrigg Summit at 38.6 47), proper Show Pony stuff.

    No need to really do anything much to the foot of Shap. As we approached Low Gill I could see blackened trackside. Nothing much. Perhaps 25 yards long going away from the track up the rocky side. The gradient is only 777r. No steam up here since the 20th May when 45231 ran with the Lakelander. The vegetation was green so even the escape of hot coals from the ashpan would have had a problem finding anything to burn; and isn't that watered down these days? A mystery.

    Not much being done up front as I watched the loco on the curves. With most of the effort from the back we passed Tebay at 68 (64); passed Scout Green at 39 (34.8) with speed falling rapidly. Stan the bear and his minder were grinning talking about leeks and fuel lines. Weird pair. Thinking back I did get Haynes Manuals' for Class 37s and 47s a while ago that I most certainly didn't order. And on Wednesday the leek for the sauce to accompany our fish dinner disappeared. Back to the train, surprisingly speed fell back more than expected and we were only doing 29.1 (33.9) at the climbing summit and the diesel didn't sound that well. Down the other side with not much noise at all and then near to mp47 the 37 cut out. We came to a stand but couldn't see any red signals as the locomotive was on a curve. Heard the driver try to restart the diesel a few times to no avail. Note: Need to acknowledge that StephenG was at the lineside filming and posted that the lineside was tinder dry under the greenery. Couldn't see that on the train. thanks for the post.

    What a shame. It was declared a failure. We didn't move and wondered if the Scot didn't have enough of a head of steam to lift the train as we were on the 191r. Watching from the opposite side we saw the safety valves eventually rise and the drain cocks were opened. Proper steam and suspiciously I could have sworn the bear and his minder high fived. We only drifted through Penrith at 30 but then it was a proper steam run with 14 up. The Scot got to 71 on the falling grade past mp59 1/2 and we ran in the low/mid 60s to mp65 1/2. We slowed and crossed to Upperby Yard and stopped as soon as the Class 37 was in the loop and still under the short length of wires as I'd been told that the Class 86 was being sent to collect it with no replacement diesel being provided. We felt the separation of the dead 37 and drew forward to take on water from the waiting tanker. The bear and his minder were very quiet but looked happy.

    Just a snack for lunch, a splendid Melton Mowbray Pork pie with salad and a bottle of Old Speckled Hen. Still couldn't believe with nowt happening on the network we couldn't have gone into Carlisle. We'd only seen one freight train all day. And we'd have been middle of the 3rd carriage, not middle of the 10th on the run over the S&C and Wilpshire.

    Thoughts from the regular steam folk was that Mick Rawling, our driver for the day, would be under instruction to take it easy to not risk setting any fires on the 132r to Low House and probably on the climbs to Ais Gill and Wilpshire Summits later in the afternoon. We'd soon see.

    Watering done we were allowed out 4 early. Not an aggressive start away from Petteril Bridge Jn and only 27.5 past Cumwhinton, 3 miles into the 132r climb, and we only got to a max of 36 past Howe & Co SB. After that speed fell slowly to cross Eden Brows at 32.7. once off the 132r speed rose to 46 over Low House LC and then to 55 before Armathwaite, 54. Definitely in fire risk mode. Bit noisier on the 176r after the viaduct and into the tunnel. Noisy enough for us to hear back in carriage 10 as Mick had to use more steam on the 220r to Baron's Wood Tunnels, No1 entered at 50; No2 at 48.1. even down the 165f speed only rose to 57. Trackside was very green with new growth green ferns in abundance. Network Rail really are a disgrace for allowing so much undergrowth, bushes included, to encroach so close to the running lines.

    Bit of a rise into Lazonby, 51.3, and down the 264f to 56 then 58 on the level. Still better than being on a farcical Saphos, Steam Dreams or sadly for a Western Fan, Vintage Trains. Bit more noise over the 132r past Little Salkeld, 53, but down to 48 after a short bit of 110r. The batteries in my GPS entered into the spirit of the day and ran down then failed. The gorilla just laughed. Even he couldn't affect them. GPS back and 54 past mp287 1/2, 264r. Into Waste Bank Tunnel, top of a mile+ of 330r, at 57, a speed held over Culgaith LC. Bit more noise drifted back on the 132r/220t to New Biggin, 50.3; then a bit of acceleration on the 490r to pass mp282, opposite the Gypsum Works, at 53.4. undulating track then all the way to Appleby. Long Marton,300f, was passed at 53.5 and that was it as Mick let the Scot run on the 1 1/2 m of 120r to end it with Appleby in sight at 21.5. We trundles into the station 47m 24s after leaving Upperby. We were 1 down against a generous schedule. Time elapsed from Upperby was 47m 23.7s. 3-4 minutes slower than usual.

    Nothing to go down to town for so we stayed around the station chatting with friends. We got into the shop in time to avoid the queue that rapidly formed once it was known there was ice cream there. I settled for a superb Double Chocolate Variety followed by a Jersey Cream Dessert. Delicious. Bill and I went to see who was crewing the loco. The Scot looked superb in bright sunshine. Sunshine for the third CME in a row. What is the world coming to. We saw Mick Rawling but didn't see the face of the fireman who we later found out was Martyn Soames. They'd already taken water and then surprisingly drew forward. No other trains around so we weren't expecting it to back into the siding. Mick put the Scot into reverse gear and did reverse back towards the sidings but stopped with only the brake off the running line. Odd that but it was a hot day and perhaps the signaller wanted something to do.

    A long blast on the hooter to get everyone back on the train in time for a right time departure. A gentle start but we did hear the three cylinder chatter as we ran through the station and passed mp277, 440r, at 20, then passed mp276 3/4 on the level at 24.6. said it all really. Mick made a bit of use of the 176f to get up to 47.8 at mp275 3/4, then to 50.5 on the level before the start of the 100r at mp275 1/4, passed at 51. Across Ormside Viaduct and on the left hand curve we passed mp275 at 50.4. No thoughts of anything special over the Blue Riband Section today. As has become the norm of late we lost close to 8 mph on the mile to mp274, passed at 42.6 Speed continued to fall and we only entered Helm Tunnel at 37.4. back out into the sunshine and down to 34.4 at mp273. It had taken us over 8 minutes thus far. Hopefully it was fire risk driving and not an off key Scot.

    There's a respite from the 100r from mp271 3/4. We passed mp271 3/4 at only 28.7 and were glad of the respite 1 1/4m of 166r, left at 29.3; then almost a mile of 200r, left at 37.5 after we'd crossed Crosby Garret Viaduct. That's 10 mph down on a poor day's running. Better on the 1/2m of level and a dizzying 40.8. The trackside was very green and didn't look prone to spark induced fires. Back on the 100r and speed fell to 34.6 at mp268 and to a low 29.1 at mp267. We ran through Waitby Cutting just about holding 29, then through Kirby Stephen Station hooter sounding at 27.8. We'd already been running for 20 minutes and had 6 1/2 miles to go to the summit. Speed rose a bit on the 264r and the next 3/4m of 100r to 32.3 at mp266. Only valve chatter from the front just about being heard at the back as we lost almost 5 mph over the next mile, mp265 passed at 27.6. Not an easy thing to tackle the S&C under a fire risk scenario.

    We struggled into Birkett Tunnel at 24.7 and by mp264 were down to 23.5. The last respite on the climb, the 330r to Mallerstang saw a pick up to 32.8 just past mp263. Elapsed time so far was already 27m 41s. We began to think the coal wasn't up to much as despite a lot of greenery around to the summit our speed fell to 24.7 at mp262 and 22 at mp261. We ran across Ais Gill viaduct at only 20.8 and we passed the climbing summit, mp260 at 19.5. The time was irrelevant but we'd actually taken 35m 16.7 secs from Appleby; 29m 58.4s from mp275. Once we came off the 100r, speed rose to 26 on the level as we passed the disgracefully unreadable Summit Board, 35m 55.4s from Appleby; 30m 37.8s from mp275.

    Bit more life and sound from the front on the level to Shotlock Hill Tunnel, 36.2. we passed mp258 on the 165f at 42.6; entered Moorcock Tunnel at 45.1 and crossed Dandry Mire Viaduct and passed mp257 just after at 41.8. 1/2m of 288r through Garsdale, 39 then across the top to Rise Hill Tunnel. On the 330r speed held around 40, mp255, 40.1. into Rise Hill Tunnel at 39.5/out at 36.3 then through Dent at 33. Bit of noise and black smoke down the 264f to hit 44 at mp252 1/2, then across Arten Gill Viaduct at 48.5; Dent Head Viaduct at 49.5, both on 264r. Into Blea Moor Tunnel, 440r, at 48.5, out at 40, braking for the restriction over Batty Moss Viaduct, 30 this week.

    After we left the viaduct and passed through Ribblehead Station, mp247 1/4, 34.7, we had a near normal run down the 100r. We passed mp246 at 52; mp245 at 61.4; mp244 1/2 at 63.8; and mp244 at 61.8. Touch of brakes then Horton-in-Ribblesdale, mp242 1/2, at 57.1 and ran down to Settle in the low 60s, station at 57.5. Bit of noise from the front as we passed Settle Junction Signal Box, mp234 44c, at 62 and on the 181r of Bell Busk. Lots of tall green grass and we passed mp234 at 53.2; mp233 1/2 at 52.6 and mp233, 116r, at 47.2. Nice bit of entertainment. Then a light brake application but still 41 through Long Preston and 30.6 on the 114r at mp232 1/4 before braking harder for the run into the loop at Hellifield, some 16 minutes down.

    Absolutely no worries about avoiding the Rochdale Flyer as it was grounded. Watering only took 11 minutes and with the line of sight signal box we were away 12 down. Never a section of track for speed as it's classed as a 'freight only' line with a 45 mph speed limit. Plenty of slack in the time allowed to Horrocksford Jn, 13 1/4 miles in 28 minutes with no significant rising gradients. Bill came down to join me as his seat was wrong side for mileposts for the rest of the day. Took us 21m 18s with minimal effort.

    All downgrade to Whalley. Mp18, 20.f, passed at 31.3, slowing for the Arches, the start of the 81 1/2r. We seem to cross them at a different speed each time. Today it was a steady 30 with a lovely valve chatter from the front. We came off the arches at 26. No way to take it easy on this climb. Nice noise from up front as we passed mp17 at 25.1 and with a bit of acceleration to pass mp16 3/4, yet another post with the head on the ground getting dirtier by the day, at 29.5. We guess Mick was satisfied with the settings on the Scot and let it do its' thing and that was to pass mp16 at 24.1; Langho at 25.5; mp15 at 25.2; mp14 1/2 at 23.2. We lost speed in the cutting despite the gradient easing to 88r, to pass mp14 1/4 with the loco already in the tunnel, at 23.3. Our carriage left the tunnel with the train at 21.7. Speed fell as we passed mp13 3/4, 88r/86r, at 21.3. Mp13 1/2 is near the midpoint of the old Wilpshire Station but has disappeared under ivy and weeds. Our speed was down to 20.9. Final bit of noise from the front as we passed mp13 1/4, 86r, on Ramsgreave and Wilpshire Station, at 21.1. Just after, speed rose to 24 as the Scot was over the top. Long grass was hiding the summit's gradient marker.

    Looking out at the trackside on the climb we saw mostly green grass and vegetation, hardly any places where there was anything likely to burn if sparks landed there.

    Summit speeds are a bit rubbish when you're 9 1/2 carriages and 202 yards back; i.e. almost half the distance between 1/4 mileposts on banks like Wilpshire where the summit sees a serious rapid change from 86r to 73f. Even if the Scot was shut off as soon as the summit was crested, momentum and gravity would lead to a false fast speed when carriage 10 crested the summit. Only a 3 mph increase after Ramsgreave and Wilpshire today as the approach speed was a slow 21. Grayrigg, Shap and Ais Gill are plateau summits where the 1/4 mile after the climbing summit is on level track, though even on these as the locomotive is being worked a 3-4 mph increase in speed is common. The climb of Wilpshire today was as good as we could expect under the circumstances.

    Quite a novelty then as we ran through Daisyfield Jn without even a slowing. We ran through an almost deserted Blackburn Station at 30.5 and ran down the bank to pass Hoghton LC, 101f, 5 miles down, at 60. Just a trundle down in the 50s the rest of the way to Lostock Hall Jn. No trains around again so we went straight in to P6 at Preston 3 early at 1744. Glad to see the 86 in the bay. The original number E3137 was on our side, with the name plate Peter Pan, the last of its names in service. RTT has no timings for the 86's 'rescue' mission; Preston to Upperby loop and back to Carnforth but it must have taken a good few hours .

    Wandered up to say thanks to Mick and Martyn and how lucky we were that the train was allowed to run diesel free, albeit being driven carefully to mitigate the risk of fire setting.

    Our luck had held and we did have a steam hauled train for a fourth successive Saturday. OK, we lost Yealand, Grayrigg and Shap, but we ended up with a late 1980s CME. They were one way, often only Hellifield or Blackburn to Carlisle or Carlisle to Hellifield or Blackburn. Topped 2,500 miles behind the Scot, a class of locomotive we wondered if we'd ever travel behind. Glad we have as it's a magnificent machine.

    The 86 was on and ready to go just after 1800. Bizarrely we weren't booked to depart until 1840 but control showed a degree of flexibility in the ghostlike Preston and let us out at 1816. We were back in Crewe at 1855. Home before 2100 in daylight. Nice and comfortable in the Astra as it has seat coolers as well as excellent aircon.

    Thanks to Kelly and RTC for running the train; and to Les, our Train Manager, the stewards and the Buffet folk. Both bacon rolls and sausage baps provided to order pn the day. Nice touch with little time at Appleby to get a meal.

    Thanks to WCR for providing the stock and their magnificent 46115; Mick Rawling our driver, Martyn Soames, our fireman; and the guard and support crew; but no thanks for imposing 37706 onto the train, especially as Les, our train manager wasn't told until we were in the loop at Carnforth. Lots of unhappy passengers all through the train. We know risk has to be assessed by the TOC and if they saw a real risk that the Scot would cause fires with load 11 on the banks they have to mitigate it. There might not have been rain for a while but the trackside was green in most places and there wasn't a strong wind to carry any sparks very far; and unlike a normal day, there certainly wouldn't have been any delay costs as there were no service trains to delay. Would have been good to have been told it was a decision taken on the morning due to the trackside being tinder dry under the fresh green grass growth on Shap.

    Special thanks must go to 37706 for doing the right thing and expiring before we got to Upperby. The bear and gorilla had smug looks for the rest of the day and said Chucky(?) would be pleased.

    Thanks to Les Ross himself for providing his immaculate namesake for the non-steam sections; and for letting it be used to recover the failed 37706 from Upperby and get back to Preston in plenty of time for the return to Euston.

    Thanks to Network Rail for allowing us to run on the big railway and to give us a free run all day. We only saw 2 freight trains out on the rails all day. First time that has happened on a strike day. Still wish they'd pathed the train into Carlisle but hopefully normal service will resume in August.

    A real anticlimax after the brilliant 45596 hauled Atlantic Coast Express and South Devon Explorer; but way better than the sham that was the English Riviera Express down south with 60007 on the front. Why is anyone supporting Saphos trains? The Riviera was originally effectively a Torbay Express from Bristol to Kingswear and return, 282 miles of pure steam joy. We had a cracking run with 34046 on Sunday 16th June 2019. Now look at it. Reduced to 172 miles of top and tail running with assistance from the Class 47 on the rear on the banks and sometimes elsewhere. How sad it is to see great steam locomotives reduced to that.

    After four in a row we've not got anything else booked. Too many trains with the money pit filling the programme. We'll probably gamble on the weather and book the 30th July's Royal Duchy and the 5th August's Summer CME.

    Stay safe out there.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2023
  14. J Shuttleworth

    J Shuttleworth Member

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    You might like to reconsider you comments about our "ruining 300+ passengers (sic) days out for any reason". We do not put diesels on for the hell of it - the decision was taken on Saturday morning, in consideration of a more local view of the prevailing weather conditions. Selfishly, you may not care about a precipitating a summer steam 'ban' (in the event, you would no doubt just stay at home), but we do.

    JS
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2023
  15. sgthompson

    sgthompson Part of the furniture Friend

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    The ground at Shap Wells was tinder dry with plenty of long dry grass etc so any sparks or cinder’s from 46115 because it was working hard would certainly have started a fire that would’ve quickly spread with the easterly wind. Things might look green but unless you’re actually standing on it you can’t say it’s ok just because you’re looking out of a window.
     
  16. Gladiator 5076

    Gladiator 5076 Part of the furniture

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    And to prove a point it can happen anytime anywhere.
    A friend sent me this picture taken February 15th this year caused by a loco doing less than 25mph
     

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  17. 1020 Shireman

    1020 Shireman Part of the furniture Friend

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    Selfish we are not, quite the opposite. We only want to travel on proper steam hauled trains so would NEVER advocate any running that would jeopardise proper steam running, let alone a ban. Yes we hate diesels on the back or instead of steam haulage and we keep being told we are in a minority so the majority have no issues at all and that's fine. But believe it or not, and you probably won't, when there is a fire risk and I question the steam locomotives being on the front at all. RTC's Ts&Cs cover the use of a diesel in such circumstances and it gives us no pleasure travelling on a Show Pony Steam run. What's the point? Wastes coal and water. We'll have a moan but that's all. Still don't understand why your train guard couldn't take the tannoy and explain that it was tinder dry under the apparent greenery on Shap so you'd taken the decision that it was too risky to run steam hauled. We really did expect a replacement diesel to be sent to Upperby or Appleby.

    My comments were what it looked from the window on the train. As for the comments about ruining the train for the passengers, we have been baffled by diesels being added more than once, 28th January was an example, due to adverse rail conditions that no-one from your organisation ever has the courtesy to explains where, especially when we look from the train and all we can see are shiny rails. Tell it like it is please. Is that too much to expect? We are the paying passengers after all.
     
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  18. Big Al

    Big Al Nat Pres stalwart Staff Member Moderator

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    All fair comment....but with nothing to replace the '37', apparently, the judgement call on risk was changed for the S&C. The weather didn't change and the risk was arguably far greater when you compare Carnforth to Carlisle with Carlisle to Hellifield to Blackburn.

    That's right. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. :)
     
  19. D1002

    D1002 Resident of Nat Pres

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    Last edited: Jun 5, 2023
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  20. Will RL

    Will RL Member

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    Consider trying to get a driver at such short notice. Or that the same driver of the 37 may have been the one necessary to bring another diesel to the train, at which point, having gone back to Carnforth, how late would that have made the charter.
    Sounds like excellent work from Rawling to bring the charter back over the S&C and onto Preston driving to the conditions.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 6, 2023

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