Saphos 2024

Oswald is not a big fan of all things diesel - but each to his (or her) own. I had hoped to get out to see "something proper" yesterday, Bahamas LE move, but arrangements had to be changed, so today was something of a compensation. (Not really, but better than nothing). The day dawned dull, drab, dreary even murky but the blue and white HST stands out even on a dull day.

The Settle to Carlisle & Tyne Valley Pullman had a booked pathing stop in Hellifield loop making it possible to film it at Gargrave and Long Preston. Diego came in just as I was leaving (10.00). An uneventful journey over to Gargrave where a check on RTT showed that a 12 minute deficit at Shipley was being quickly reduced. Oswald readied himself on an otherwise empty station. Now only 2L at Skipton. The train appeared from around the bend and powered towards the station, a blast on the horn, then a single "parp" to acknowledge Oswald's wave - thanks. With plenty of roar from the power cars the HST sped through the station and quickly disappeared into the distance. 11C, 4L & 61mph.

Over to Long Preston. As I drove past Hellifield it was reassuring to see blue and white coaches stopped alongside the station. I managed to find/create a parking spot on the station car park; it was much busier than at weekends. It was around 20 minutes before the train was due so I headed down to the platform. There was already a frail old guy down there wandering about with a tripod. He told me that he had just filmed the Cement train, wasn't bothered about the HST but was waiting for the Stone train. We chatted whilst, in readiness, he set up for what would be a trailing shot of the Stone empties. The HST approached again a two tone on the horn and than a "parp" to acknowledge Oswald's wave - thanks again. Compared to steam, the HST made it look ridiculously easy as it accelerated through the station. 11C, RT & 45mph.

There was a ten minute wait until the empties heading for filling Arcow were due. 60085 appeared, no horn (even when Oswald waved) - shame on you, driver! The train blasted through the station with almost deafening sound and terrific turbulence that almost had Oswald's hat. Leaves that had lain undisturbed on the platforms were sucked up into the air and swirled in the trains wake. The old guy was confused as the train had appeared from the "wrong" direction - mmm! 11C, 2L & fast and noisy.

 

Anyone know why the Blue Pullman was scheduled to wait at Hellifield for 2H86 Leeds-Carlisle to go in front, when the Pullman could easily have stayed in front?
Also, anyone know what happened to delay both trains between Appleby and Culgaith?
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U30837/2024-10-23/detailed
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G32485/2024-10-23/detailed

 

I'm confused, how else was I supposed to see the train at Gargrave and then again at Long Preston?! More seriously, possibly tied to the catering arrangements giving more time for lunch before the arrival in Carlisle?

 

Was that more time for the passengers to eat lunch, or did Diego jump on board to eat his fill before allowing the train to move on?

 

Pathing at Carlisle possibly? Only platforms 1, 3 and 4 available for long trains, and the fact the train needed to reverse to head back to Upperby may have affected things.

 

Not Saphos, but as that is on a break for a few weeks, I thought I'd keep the thread going with a picture of the short 2+5 Midland Pullman set at Mallaig today 26/10

 

West Highland Pullman struggling with poor adhesion around Tulloch. Can't get up the bank. Tried going back and having a run at it but still slipped to a stand. Now heading back to the passing loop to let the Jacobite ECS go past. Hopefully that will clear the line for us and we'll be able to get up.

 

It should have a steam loco on the back.

Bryan

 

I remember doing a tour in an HST, trying to go up Copy Pit in mid October on an extended (2+9) formation. It was very slow, and a portly acquaintance did have it suggested that he go to the front power car to help with adhesion...

I can be critical of over-optimistic unassisted steam itineraries at this time of year, but the idea of taking an HST up the WHL strikes me as brave verging on foolhardy.

 

It's only 2+5 though, so it shouldn't have been such an issue. Though I wonder if the lack of a Saturday evening/Sunday morning sleeper hasn't helped clear the rail head a bit - the last service was 12 hours previously.

 

It brings back memories of explaining to a "new wave" manager why pairs of class 86's were not much good at hauling freightliners up Brentwood bank in the autumn but a single class 66 with less power was fine.
The looks from the drivers on the HST and a test train worked by a class 37 were something to behold while I explained sanding equipment from the platform in Paddington. The test train driver even worked the sanders... ( Perhaps it was all too technical for Princess Fi-Fi.)

Cheers, Neil

 

Apologies for lack of further updates yesterday. After posting that message I couldn't get to NatPres at all on my phone for the rest of the day, kept getting an error message. Anyway, back home now on the computer.

The area where we ran into difficulty was Monessie Gorge, in between Roy Bridge and Tulloch. We slipped to a stand and couldn't get going again, despite several attempts. Reversed back a bit and tried again - same problem. Ironically, the tour booklet that LSL provide to passengers specifically mentions this section of the line as being problematic for southbound trains after heavy rainfall. It was a Sunday and the first ScotRail service wasn't for several hours - we were the first train up since the heavy rain overnight.

Rather fortuitously, behind us was the Jacobite empty stock. Black 5, 2 Class 37s and a rake of Mk2s heading home to Carnforth. With us blocking the line, they were being held in the passing loop at Spean Bridge. We reversed back to Spean Bridge and pulled in alongside them so they could proceed. Doors were unlocked and passengers were allowed out onto the platform for a leg stretch. The Black 5, although sandwiched behind the lead 37, was clearly working hard as their train departed Spean Bridge. Impressive plume of smoke and some deafening growls from the 37s. Spectacular departure with all three locos clearly working full pelt.

A few minutes later we got the all clear and departed after them. We had no trouble at all this time so The Jacobite had clearly corrected the track conditions for us. We then overtook them a few hours later just past Craigendoran Jn, shortly after leaving the West Highland Line.

So, basically, WCR got LSL out of a bit of a pickle yesterday. I don't know how long we would have been stuck there trying to get up that bank if they hadn't been behind us.

Next weekend is the final West Highland Pullman tour of this year so it will be interesting to see what happens next Sunday.

 

It would seem that the ratio of total adhesion weight to total train weight was significantly better for the WCRC train with the three locos than for the HST with two. Even so I am surprised that the ratio for the HST was inadequate. The ratio for the Caledonian Sleeper, with a single loco and a few coaches, would be considerably worse than either, so the Sleeper would be in trouble but for previous traffic during the day having cleaned the rails.

Wouldn't it have been fun if the WCRC train had been sent to bank the Saphos one?

 

Thanks for the story, Nathan. Challenging for the staff but I don't suppose the passengers would have been too upset by it. In my experience they usually consider it as part of the adventure.

If anyone is not familiar with Monessie Gorge here is a shot taken in 2011 (in the days when you were still able to lean out of windows) of the returning Jacobite stock in fairly similar conditions. You can see the possible problems. As this was a Saturday there had been two trains through here already and the two Fives managed without much difficulty, but you never know.................

Peter

 

You're not allowing for the gearing - the HST is high geared to allow the performance at speed. That costs in performance at lower speeds - think of the restrictions on HSTs on the South Devon banks when working on one power car, or otherwise impaired.

 

Perhaps they'll put a 47 on the back, nothing is safe.


Many thanks for your reports, most interesting to read.

 

If the problem were limited TE, that would be just as bad on a dry rail. Surely the actual problem was insufficient adhesion on a slippery rail.

 

It was. But the gearing means that HSTs may struggle where other trains will be fine.

 

Very much so.

Also this autumn is noted as notoriously bad for much of the network. I know a lot of crews from different TOCs saying it’s poor in a lot of places.