Vintage Trains 2025

Potentially 3 steam tours north over Shap and then south over the S&C on this date. There's also a Cumbrian Mountain Express and a Northern Belle. Will bring some interesting pathing problems, especially on the S&C. Fingers crossed for good weather.

 

Shouldn’t be too bad. Northern Belle and CME can usually rung together; and Bahamas is much later path timings than those two.

 

Couple of seats booked in Enthusiast Class - can't wait!

Nick M.

 

According to RTT it is a day when nothing runs north of Carlisle, so platform space I guess will be at a premium. Something may end up with Appleby as a destination.

 

Last time this happened, 7029 was heading over the S&C and Network Rail told them they'd have to take a diesel due to capacity issues at Carlisle which would affect the turning movements. Hope this isn't the case in March.

 

On a quick look the outward Northern Belle and Vintage and return CME and Northern Belle look to be more or less at the same time. But the Vintage has three hours at Carlisle so can park out of the way.

Presumably the Vintage diesel will be shadowing the train to/from Carlisle anyway and will be used for the turning movements? I think that's what happened with 5043 this year.

 

Enthusiast Class now sold out on the Shap Mountaineer trip. Hopefully other classes are also booking well.

 

Few more tours announced on the website now. The Whistling Ghost to Minehead 31st May, The Cathedrals Express to Swansea 5th July and the White Rose to Scarborough 19th July.

 

Thanks for the heads-up. Have booked on the Swansea tour and will be booking on the Minehead one once I get my next pay packet. I know this has come up before, but the booking fee they impose really is a killer isn't it? An extra £13.50 I had to pay, over and above the advertised ticket price. Then they have the cheek after that to ask if you also want to donate to their charitable trust.

 

I'm not going to criticise a tour operator for doing this when this disgraceful practice is endemic across booking sites.

The justification generally offered is that this is an additional cost that isn't part of the product or service being purchased, especially as the booking platforms often work on a per transaction charge. The reality is that the company has chosen to present its prices at a certain (low) level, and then apply a surcharge for a necessary part of the purchasing process. I resent this at a cinema, the theatre, or buying airline tickets; I think no different about Vintage Trains.

 

I was doing a bit of Googling about it and came across the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024, which received Royal Assent in May but hasn't yet been passed into law. One of the things in there is that hidden charges such as booking fees need to be displayed to the consumer right at the start of the purchase process (ie - on the webpage where prices are stated), rather than suddenly appearing as a surprise midway through the booking process.

 

I didn't realise the booking fee is per ticket, not per booking. There doesn't appear to be a fee if you phone up and book though from what I can see.

 

I always book with VT directly by phone, and never get charged the booking fee. This seems daft as online bookings should be cheaper for the company to support than paying someone to sit there ready to answer the phones!

It does seem the booking fees charged by the FareHarbor system are excessive for every railway/company that uses it.
It seems that unlike most booking platforms, it charges a strict percentage, rather than a nominal fee capped at a couple of quid.

The Ffestiniog Railway's FareHabor booking site is another one that charges an extortionate booking fee, but again there are no fees when booking by phone.

 

As to booking fees, it is quite simple guys. Fareharbour offer us (and many other heritage railways) a website fit for purpose for bookings free of charge for us. If we developed our own website that would cost us the thick end of £100k these days which we can’t afford. Most customers accept a booking fee (just like the theatre). For the moment you can avoid the booking fee but making a telephone booking, so why not do that? But pleased be advised we will probably limit this facility to frequent travellers as part of a loyalty programme at some future date

 

The reality is we present our prices as is and also let you know there is a website booking fee up front. As above, we cannot afford to change this practice and continue to provide our trains. We hope you will book but if you decide not to we understand, but think our tours will become increasingly popular with opening toplight windows in each carriage, enthusiast tourist, unassisted steam on selected journeys, reliable traction and increased extended Shakespeares. Please bear in mind we are the only Charity operating on the main line as all others are commercial profit making companies

 

I have had to consider charity pricing through such as EventBrite, and appreciate the challenge you face. As a consumer, in whatever market, I regard the practice with disfavour even where declared in advance, and consider the provision of a booking service, however provisioned, as part of the core cost of providing the product and therefore something that should be within the overall price. I feel just the same about the practice at theatres, and have done for many years.

My views perhaps belong in the "wind me up" thread, but one of the reasons that the booking platforms can levy such significant charges is that the treatment of their fees as passthrough items minimises the competitive pressure they face. If forced to justify their prices to the firms that they sell to within the prices that those firms can sell to the public at, I suspect their charges would fall significantly. Perhaps this is a market ripe for Competition and Markets Authority investigation?

 

I don't think it's unreasonable to have a small fee to cover providing the cost of a service, and I do appreciate Michael coming on here to provide more explanation.

It's just the level of fee that FareHarbor charge that seems extortionate.
A £355 Pullman Seat on an upcoming VT tour incurs an addition £20.70 in fees (6%), a table for two £43,70, even Ryanair would blush at that!
If it was capped at say, £2.50 a transaction, it would be a lot more reasonable.

I don't know the exact commercial relationship between VT (and heritage railways) and Fareharbor, but it does feel like Fareharbor are doing exceptionally well out of offering a 'free' service to charities.
A train of 200 people paying an average of £200 a seat, at 6%, that's £2,400 per train!

Other companies use other booking systems with much more reasonable fees, Pathfinder and RTC seem to use a fee-free common system which obviously works for them. Many of the heritage railways use systems that charge a couple of quid per transaction.

Obviously, this is ultimately a commercial decision by VT, and they're the ones who can see the detailed numbers, but the optics are not great, it does feel like someone is being fleeced here, whether it's the customer or VT themselves!